Actually reading Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics is worth it. Not because he's right about everything (he has some pretty messed up and weird views), but because it's challenging and good to think on, and chances are you'll take something away for yourself that you wouldn't have gotten from some webpage that took one-liners out of context, some of which aren't even by Aristotle.
acephal 54 minutes ago [-]
It’s weird and messed up because Aristotle’s audience isn’t Christian or even Abrahamic the slightest. He’s right about rejecting abstract definitions that aren’t grounded in the elements of a situation however.
geye1234 4 hours ago [-]
The level of precision a subject can reach is peculiar to that subject, but it doesn't follow that nothing can be accurately predicated of it:
"It is characteristic of such knowledge [ethics] that it should be deficient in “exactness,” in precision of statement, and closeness of logical concatenation. We must not look for a mathematics of conduct. The subject-matter of Human Conduct is not governed by necessary and uniform laws. But this does not mean that it is subject to no laws."
"[T]he man of education will seek exactness so far in each subject as the nature of the thing admits, it being plainly much the same absurdity to put up with a mathematician who tries to persuade instead of proving, and to demand strict demonstrative reasoning of a Rhetorician."
FWIW, I got a lot more about virtue ethics from reading Plato's works, the Stoics, and Cicero. Aristotle is somewhat dry and tedious to read. Go for him if you're into formal logic and related technical systems. But if you're truly interested in virtue ethics and have some reading discipline, try Seneca, Epictetus, and Marcus Aurelius.
On Marcus Aurelius: he's often recommended mindlessly (especially in tech circles). I actually to suggest to read him last. He does have valuable things to say, but he's the most depressive of the Big Three Stoics. You can better appreciate Aurelius if you've already digested some Socratic dialogues and Epictetus. One of the top-most Stoicism scholars (A. A. Long) describes Marcus Aurelius this way: "a melancholy emperor, who was hardly a card-carrying Stoic".
FWIW, here's[1] my recommended reading order and top English translations from five years ago. Cut out the cheap rehashes by people such as Ryan Holiday and stick to the originals. A bonus note[2] on the Roman gem, Cicero, from six years ago.
Plato is delightfully weird and engaging and way more fun to read than Aristotle, agreed.
technics256 4 hours ago [-]
The first quote is not even a quote from Aristotle but from Will Durant’s book, The Story of Philosophy (1926)
johnsmith1840 2 hours ago [-]
Pretty low effort article I like the quotes but yeah.
My favorite part is the useless comment bellow each quote like:
"The commenter above has stated that the quote is not from aristotle, this is important for the article"
krapp 3 hours ago [-]
"Don't believe everything you read on the internet" -- Sun Tzu
great_wubwub 3 hours ago [-]
“We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.”
This invalidates the post for me, it takes it from academic research to fanboy posting.
ceroxylon 1 hours ago [-]
Funnily enough, people attributing "smart sounding" quotes to Aristotle has been a headache for historians for as long as Aristotle's writing has been around. The more things change...
al_be_back 3 hours ago [-]
> 2. "Happiness depends upon ourselves."
he's quiet possibly referring to happiness as a relationship (with family, friends, colleagues, citizens etc) rather than just by oneself / isolation / individual. he famously said "man by nature is a political animal" (or social if you prefer)
yoyohello13 3 hours ago [-]
I expect it’s more similar to the Buddhist idea that happiness is cultivated in your own mind. It’s driven internally rather than externally.
sdellis 3 hours ago [-]
Social and political are very different, unless you are overly concerned with accumulating power within your social relationships.
skinfaxi 3 hours ago [-]
I would submit that all social relationships have power dynamics. Politics is about allocation of resources more than power accumulation. You may be conflating the two because more power allows you to allocate resources with less intereference.
graboy 1 hours ago [-]
It's more social, the translation of political is coming from polis; man is by nature meant to be part of a city or community.
foolswisdom 2 hours ago [-]
In the original its meaning is being part of a greater unit.
al_be_back 2 hours ago [-]
of course they are. his original quote says 'political' but often translations or quotes may say 'social' (informally).
iambenm 36 minutes ago [-]
Missing my favorite from Aristotle on knowledge: "The purpose of knowledge is action, not knowledge"
Good for getting out of endless HN/Reddit/Wikipedia loops!
Much of this is either simply not Aristotle, or a paraphrase from one of his works incorrectly attributed to another.
My slop meter is pinging.
Edit:
Between the misattributions, fabricated quotes, listicle format, thin explanatory paragraphs, and use of “delve” (posted Nov 2024 - during ChatGPT’s Delve Era), this is a pretty embarrassing thing for a Liberal Arts college to post.
yunnpp 14 minutes ago [-]
Thanks for delving, I hadn't picked up on the misattributions. But I'm looking to read some of those books now given the comments here.
groundzeros2015 2 hours ago [-]
It’s also embarrassing to see a philosopher summarized in quotes or sayings when their real thesis is probably the opposite of what the snippet suggests,
Philosophy is not about clever observations! They are developing systems and arguments you have to actually read to understand.
deepfriedbits 3 hours ago [-]
> "Friendship is a single soul dwelling in two bodies."
What a cool way to convey the benefits of having strong friendships.
Razengan 8 minutes ago [-]
You know I always found it weird how religions got started around Jesus, Muhammed etc but not around Aristotle, Socrates etc.
notorandit 4 hours ago [-]
If you ever wondered, those are among the things that made that single person standing out of the crowd od Humanity for more than two thousands years.<3
andsoitis 4 hours ago [-]
“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.”
magicmicah85 2 hours ago [-]
I see this quote a lot and can never find it in original sources for Aristotle. It seems to be a misattribution from the foreword of Religion and the Pursuit of Truth by Lowell L Bennion
Entertaining an idea is understanding it. And, there is some research to show that understanding an idea is believing it. Hence, understanding an idea and not believing it is very effortful.
Along the same lines:
"Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence."
-- Robert Frost
john_strinlai 4 hours ago [-]
>From Aristotle?
apparently not, actually:
"The earliest that this quotation appears in print is in Religion and the Pursuit of Truth (1959) by Lowell Bennion."
or
"First attributed to Aristotle in Lowell L. Bennion, Religion and the Pursuit of Truth (1959). Unfound as such.
Sometimes thought (though I feel it's a bit of a stretch) a misinterpretation of Nicomachean Ethics 1.3.4 (1094b): "For it is the mark of an educated person to search for the same kind of clarity in each topic to the extent that the nature of the matter accepts it.""
notorandit 4 hours ago [-]
Maybe, yes "maybe" Robert got inspiration from a guy who lived two thousands years earlier.
ignoramous 3 hours ago [-]
The aim of the wise is not to secure pleasure, but to avoid pain.
Reminds me of Charlie Munger's Inversion principle that he borrowed from German mathematician Carl Gustav Jacob Jacobi's man muss immer umkehren. https://fs.blog/inversion/
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
This Amjad Masad comment lives rent-free in my head: "Tolerating some amount of cognitive dissonance is one of the best things that I was able to develop in myself ... people don't update their beliefs when new evidence comes to light ... The drive to avoid cognitive dissonance shackles you to your existing beliefs (see confirmation bias)". https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11799477 (2016).
"It is characteristic of such knowledge [ethics] that it should be deficient in “exactness,” in precision of statement, and closeness of logical concatenation. We must not look for a mathematics of conduct. The subject-matter of Human Conduct is not governed by necessary and uniform laws. But this does not mean that it is subject to no laws."
"[T]he man of education will seek exactness so far in each subject as the nature of the thing admits, it being plainly much the same absurdity to put up with a mathematician who tries to persuade instead of proving, and to demand strict demonstrative reasoning of a Rhetorician."
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/8438/8438-h/8438-h.htm
On Marcus Aurelius: he's often recommended mindlessly (especially in tech circles). I actually to suggest to read him last. He does have valuable things to say, but he's the most depressive of the Big Three Stoics. You can better appreciate Aurelius if you've already digested some Socratic dialogues and Epictetus. One of the top-most Stoicism scholars (A. A. Long) describes Marcus Aurelius this way: "a melancholy emperor, who was hardly a card-carrying Stoic".
FWIW, here's[1] my recommended reading order and top English translations from five years ago. Cut out the cheap rehashes by people such as Ryan Holiday and stick to the originals. A bonus note[2] on the Roman gem, Cicero, from six years ago.
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22990579
[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24638573
My favorite part is the useless comment bellow each quote like: "The commenter above has stated that the quote is not from aristotle, this is important for the article"
Aristotle never said this. It's Will Durant.
https://medium.com/the-mission/my-favourite-quote-of-all-tim...
https://old.reddit.com/r/askphilosophy/comments/s2n3s/source...
This invalidates the post for me, it takes it from academic research to fanboy posting.
he's quiet possibly referring to happiness as a relationship (with family, friends, colleagues, citizens etc) rather than just by oneself / isolation / individual. he famously said "man by nature is a political animal" (or social if you prefer)
Good for getting out of endless HN/Reddit/Wikipedia loops!
Edit:
Between the misattributions, fabricated quotes, listicle format, thin explanatory paragraphs, and use of “delve” (posted Nov 2024 - during ChatGPT’s Delve Era), this is a pretty embarrassing thing for a Liberal Arts college to post.
Philosophy is not about clever observations! They are developing systems and arguments you have to actually read to understand.
What a cool way to convey the benefits of having strong friendships.
https://archive.org/details/religionpursuito0000lowe/page/n5...
Entertaining an idea is understanding it. And, there is some research to show that understanding an idea is believing it. Hence, understanding an idea and not believing it is very effortful.
[1] https://bear.warrington.ufl.edu/brenner/mar7588/Papers/gilbe...
Along the same lines: "Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence." -- Robert Frost
apparently not, actually:
"The earliest that this quotation appears in print is in Religion and the Pursuit of Truth (1959) by Lowell Bennion."
or
"First attributed to Aristotle in Lowell L. Bennion, Religion and the Pursuit of Truth (1959). Unfound as such.
Sometimes thought (though I feel it's a bit of a stretch) a misinterpretation of Nicomachean Ethics 1.3.4 (1094b): "For it is the mark of an educated person to search for the same kind of clarity in each topic to the extent that the nature of the matter accepts it.""
cf. Why people that are often right change their minds often, https://fs.blog/some-advice-from-jeff-bezos/