NHacker Next
  • new
  • past
  • show
  • ask
  • show
  • jobs
  • submit
Google plans to invest up to $40B in Anthropic (bloomberg.com)
elffjs 6 hours ago [-]
freakynit 35 seconds ago [-]
Funny how the strongest challenge to Nvidia's near-monopoly(full monopoly?) is coming from Google, and not AMD.

Still rooting for AMD to catch up too, especially if they can continue improving their software stack. They seem to be moving in the right direction.. though, they could benefit from speeding up a bit more.

Google now has it's fingers in all the pies.. is successfully fully vertically integrated and now expanding horizontally.

skybrian 3 hours ago [-]
Context: a few weeks ago, Anthropic signed a deal to buy "multiple gigawatts of next-generation TPU capacity" from Google and Broadcom [1]. There have been several previous deals, too.

Some people call this sort of thing a "circular deal", but perhaps a better way to think of it is as a very large-scale version of vendor financing? The simple version of vendor financing is when a vendor gives a retailer time to pay for goods they purchased for resale. This is effectively a loan that's backed by the retailer's ability to resell the goods. There's a possibility that the retailer goes broke and doesn't pay, but the vendor has insight into how well the retailer is doing, so they know if they're a good risk.

Similarly, Google likely knows quite a lot about Anthropic because Anthropic buys computing services from Google for resale. They're making an equity investment rather than a loan, but the money will be coming back to Google, assuming Anthropic's sales continue to rise as fast as they have been.

Also, if you own Google stock, some small part of that is an investment in Anthropic?

[1] https://www.anthropic.com/news/google-broadcom-partnership-c...

fc417fc802 2 hours ago [-]
In another context I might see it as vendor financing. However given that Google and Anthropic are competitors in this segment and given that Google has previously invested in them I'd rather see this as a sort of bartered stock purchase presumably for the purpose of hedging against failure. If Anthropic wins the race and it turns out to be winner takes all and you happen to own half of Anthropic then you still win half of the immediate spoils even though your internal team lost. If you view losing the race as an existential threat then having all your eggs in the one basket is a terrible proposition.
skybrian 1 hours ago [-]
Sure, since Google is both a supplier and a competitor, it’s both vendor finance and hedging. Also, it increases their investment in AI, in general.

Arguably, too much of this kind of hedging is anti-competitive. But that doesn’t seem to be much of a problem yet?

windexh8er 6 minutes ago [-]
I look at this as Google needs a competitor. While Anthropic seems to be the flavor of the quarter OAI looks like such a dumpster fire right now that it's in Google's best interest to help keep Anthropic moving towards winning the #2 spot. I say the #2 spot because it doesn't matter how good this week's LLM is. Until someone else owns the infra and has an actually profitable business model they're all just lighting money and the world around us on fire.

I actually mentioned to a Google friend the other week that I wouldn't be surprised to see Google tipping the hat towards Anthropic soon so as to put a little more heat on OAI.

zymhan 3 hours ago [-]
To be honest, I think "vendor financing" is still a very risky premise.

Vendors may be positioned to know how a customer is doing, but they're also incentivized to overestimate how well a customer is going to perform.

GE Capital (edit: and GMCA) is a great example of how seemingly reasonable vendor financing can cause the lender serious problems.

skybrian 2 hours ago [-]
The risks are different, but there's no getting around that the value of any investment is based on future cash flows and that's speculating about the future.

To the extent that Google and Anthropic are competing for AI business, Google is somewhat hedged against Anthropic winning market share. They still get data center revenue and they own equity, so that’s a consolation prize.

On the other hand, it’s increasing Google’s investment in AI, in general.

cowsandmilk 1 hours ago [-]
GE Capital was not just vendor financing and its serious problems were not due to vendor financing. I don’t think it is a great example in any way.
matt_s 2 hours ago [-]
Reciprocal agreements aren't new, sometimes they're used to gain access to a market the other party already has established a foothold in for other industry segments. These companies operate in the same general industry: tech/internet so it could be complementary services they are each after.

So far both of these companies have shown they suck at support so we know that's not it. It could be that it might help Anthropic to leverage Gemini in their competition with OpenAI and Google will take compute commitments.

Anecdata: I'm finding a lot of my "type random question in URL/search bar" has decent top Gemini answers where I don't scroll to results unless I need to dive deeper.

pseudohadamard 18 minutes ago [-]
It's pretty much vendor financing (although we could argue whether it should be classed as circular investment), with the extra trick being that both sides get to make number go up with it, through stock market valuations and the ability to borrow more money to set fire to so you can show how successful you are.
WarmWash 2 hours ago [-]
IIRC Google already outright owns 15% of Anthropic.
colechristensen 3 hours ago [-]
It could be legit, it could be a thickly veiled accounting fraud continuing the valuation inflation with fake deals that count money multiple times.

Maybe a little bit of both.

rnxrx 2 hours ago [-]
Lots and lots of vendor financing during the dotcom era, and it ended up being a material part of those vendors' own difficulties. Especially when service providers were concerned (e.g. the huge crash in optical in particular).

Obviously it's not a perfect comparison, but you have to wonder how much of NVIDIA's income (for instance) is ultimately funded by its own money.

33MHz-i486 6 hours ago [-]
I think the subtext of the last few weeks is the Anthropic was becoming severely capacity constrained (or approaching that). They seem to have had to sign two somewhat adverse contracts with Amazon and Google in short succession. suddenly model quality is back up again.
tiffanyh 5 hours ago [-]
That’s what’s needed when you go from $9B in ARR … to $30B in ARR literally just one quarter later.

That kind of insane growth & demand is unprecedented at that scale.

https://www.anthropic.com/news/google-broadcom-partnership-c...

an0malous 4 hours ago [-]
What is all this AI doing? People are spending 10’s to 100’s of billions and no service or technology seems better or cheaper. Everything is more expensive and worse.
barnabee 3 hours ago [-]
Where I work:

- Development velocity is very noticeably much higher across the board. Quality is not obviously worse, but it's LLM assisted, not vibe coding (except for experiments and internal tools).

- Things that would have been tactically built with TypeScript are now Rust apps.

- Things that would have been small Python scripts are full web apps and dashboards.

- Vibe coding (with Claude Desktop, nobody is using Replit or any of the others) is the new Excel for non tech people.

- Every time someone has any idea it's accompanied by a multi page "Clauded" memo explaining why it's a great idea and what exactly should be done (about 20% of which is useful).

- 80% of what were web searches now go to Claude instead (for at least a significant minority of people, could easily be over 50%).

- Nobody talks about ChatGPT any more. It's Claude or (sometimes) Gemini.

- My main job isn't writing code but I try to keep Claude Code (both my personal and corpo accounts) and OpenCode (also almost always Claude, via Copilot) busy and churning away on something as close to 100% of the time as I can without getting in the way of my other priorities.

We (~20 people) are probably using 2 orders of magnitude more inference than we were at the start of the year and it's consolidated away from cursor, ChatGPT and Claude to just be almost all Claude (plus a little Gemini as that's part of our Google Whateverspace plan and some people like it, mostly for non-engineering tasks).

No idea if any of this will make things better, exactly, but I think we'd be at a severe competitive disadvantage if we dropped it all and went back how things were.

stasomatic 2 hours ago [-]
I am hobbyist playing around. Recently dropped CC (which gave me a sense of awe 2 months ago), but they realized GPUs need CapEx and I want to screw around with pi.dev on a budget. Then on to GH Copilot but couldn't understand their cost structure, ran out of quota half month in, now on Codex. I don't really see any difference for little stuff. I also have Antigravity through a personal Gmail account with access to Opus et al and I don't understand if I am paying for it or not. They don't have my CC so that's a breather.

It's all romantic, but a bunch of devs are getting canned left and right, a slice of the population whose disposable income the economy depends on.

It's too late to be a contrarian pundit, but what's been done besides uncovering some 0-days? The correction will be brutal, worse than the Industrial Revolution. Just the recent news about Meta cuts, SalesForce, Snap, Block, the list is long.

Have you shipped anything commercially viable because of AI or are you/we just keeping up?

fc417fc802 2 hours ago [-]
> The correction will be brutal, worse than the Industrial Revolution.

Has it occurred to you that there might not be a correction, and that the outcome would still be brutal, at least on par with the industrial revolution.

stasomatic 1 hours ago [-]
Do you mean as in there will be no happy ending / reset and no another century of prosperity?
fc417fc802 1 hours ago [-]
I mean as in living through the industrial revolution would have been wild. So whether we have an AI revolution or an AI bubble it's bound to be a roller coaster.

And that's without accounting for the various wars (and resultant economic impacts) that are already in progress. A large part of what drove the meat grinder of WWI was (very approximately) the various actors repeatedly misjudging the overall situation and being overly enthusiastic to try out their shiny new weapons systems. If one or more superpowers decide to have a showdown the only thing that might minimize loss of life this time around is (ironically enough) the rise of autonomous weapons systems. Even in that case as we know from WWII the logical outcome is a decimated economy and manufacturing sector regardless of anything else that might happen.

rhubarbtree 44 minutes ago [-]
Bubble or revolution - not a dichotomy.

Bubbles like the AI bubble are a game theoretic outcome of a revolution. Many players invest heavily to avoid losing, but as a whole the market over invests. This leads to a bubble.

chpatrick 24 minutes ago [-]
Imagine you're a typesetter and they just invented computerized printing.
mullingitover 3 hours ago [-]
> - Development velocity is very noticeably much higher across the board

It's an absolute tornado of PRs these days. Everyone making the most of these tools is effectively an engineering team lead.

MrDarcy 1 hours ago [-]
The CTO/VP of engineering role down is now singularly focused on keeping agents fed with a backlog of Linear issues. This is the new normal.
davidcann 3 hours ago [-]
Is your team measuring how much of your code is being written with claude and comparing amongst the team, like what works best in your codebase? How are you learning from each other?

I’m making a team version of my buildermark.dev open source project and trying to learn about how teams would like to use it.

barnabee 3 hours ago [-]
Different teams are using it in very different ways so it can be tough to compare meaningfully.

Backends handling tens to hundreds of thousands of messages per second with extremely high correctness and resilience requirements are necessarily taking a different approach to less critical services that power various ancillary sites/pages or to front end web apps.

That said there's a lot of very open discussion around tooling, "skills", MCP, etc., harnesses, and approaches and plenty of sharing and cross-pollination of techniques.

It would be great to find ways to better quantify the actual value add from LLMs and from the various ways of using them, but our experience so far is that the landscape in terms of both model capability and tooling is shifting so fast that that's quite hard to do.

davidcann 2 hours ago [-]
Thanks for the feedback. I agree that it’s changing very fast, which is why my thesis is that this tooling will be needed to help everyone on the team keep up.
jeremyjh 2 hours ago [-]
It sounds very similar to my shop. I have QA people and Product Managers using Claude to develop better integration and reporting tools in Python. Business users are vibe coding all kinds of tools shared as Claude Artifacts, the more ambitious ones are building single page app prototypes. We ported one prototype to Next.js and hosted on Vercel in a couple of days and then handed it back to them with a Devcontainer and Claude Code so they can iterate on it themselves; and we also developed all the security infrastructure, scaffolding, agent instructions & policy required to do this for low stakes apps in a responsible way.

It hardly seems worth it to try to iterate on design when they can just build a completely functional prototype themselves in a few hours. We're building APIs for internal users in preference to UIs, because they can build the UIs themselves and get exactly what they need for their specific use cases and then share it with whoever wants it.

We replaced an expensive, proprietary vendor product in a couple of weeks.

I have no delusions about the scale or complexity limits of these projects. They can help with large, complex systems but mostly at the margins: help with impact analysis, production support, test cases, code review. We generate a lot of code too but we're not vibe coding a new system of record and review standards have actually increased because refactoring is so much cheaper.

The fact is that ordinary businesses have a LOT of unmet demand for low stakes custom software. The ones that lean into this will not develop superpowers but I do think they will out-compete slow adopters and those companies will be forced to catch up in the next few years.

I develop presentations now by dumping a bunch of context in a folder with a template and telling Claude Cowork what I want (it does much better than web version because of its python and shell tools and it can iterate, render, review, repeat until its excellent). The copy is quite good, I rewrite less than a third of it and the style and graphics are so much better than I could do myself in many hours.

No one likes reading a bunch of vibe coded slop and cultural norms about this are still evolving; but on balance its worth it by far.

jwpapi 2 hours ago [-]
I think if you drop this all you will absolutely kill it.
komali2 22 minutes ago [-]
I'm not sure. I have a buddy that's one of the better engineers I know personally, and he struggled to maintain an "AI Lent" for even a month. He found he just wasn't productive enough without it.

He did a writeup: https://buduroiu.com/blog/ai-lent-end/

ttul 2 hours ago [-]
This sounds like my office, but we're a bit more tilted toward Codex. I personally use Claude Cowork for drudge-admin work, GPT 5.5-Pro for several big research tasks daily, and the LLMs munge on each other's slop all day as I try my best to wrap my head around what has been produced and get it into our document repository -- all the while being conscious that the enormous volume of stuff I'm producing is a bit overwhelming for everyone.

We are definitely reaching the point where you need an LLM to deal with the onslaught of LLM-generated content, even if the humans are being judicious about editing everything. We're all just cranking on an inhumanly massive amount of output and it's frankly scary.

Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
I'm burning an insane number of tokens 8-12 hours a day for the dramatic improvement of some internal tooling at a big tech company. Using it heavily for an unannounced future project as well.

I presume I'm not the only one.

msy 4 hours ago [-]
We suddenly have a proliferation of new internal tools and resources, nearly all of which are barely functional and largely useless with no discernible impact on the overall business trajectory but sure do seem to help come promo time.

Barely an hour goes by without a new 4-page document about something that that everyone is apparently ment to read, digest and respond to, despite its 'author' having done none of those steps, it's starting to feel actively adversarial.

kranke155 4 hours ago [-]
Without good management AI is just a new way to make terrible work in unprecedented quantities.

With good management you will get great work faster.

The distinguishing feature between organisations competing in the AI era is process. AI can automate a lot of the work but the human side owns process. If it’s no good everything collapses. Functional companies become hyper functional while dysfunctional companies will collapse.

Bad ideas used to be warded off by workers who in some shape or form of malicious compliance just would slow down and redirect the work while advocating for better solutions.

That can’t happen as much anymore as your manager or CEO can vibe code stuff and throw it down the pipeline for the workers to fix.

If you have bad processes your company will die, or shrivel or stagnate at best. Companies with good process will beat you.

qingcharles 3 hours ago [-]
My main use of vibecoding is creating dozens of internal tools that have sped up tasks, or made tasks possible that were previously not. These tools would have taken weeks of time to build manually and would have been hard to justify, rather than just struggling with manual processes every now and again. AI has been life-changing in creating these kinda janky tools with janky UI that do everything they're supposed to perfectly, but are ugly as hell.
Jach 2 hours ago [-]
Are you able to describe any of those internal tools in more detail? How important are they on average? (For example, at a prior job I spent a bit of time creating a slackbot command "/wtf acronym" which would query our company's giant glossary of acronyms and return the definition. It wasn't very popular (read: not very useful/important) but it saved myself some time at least looking things up (saving more time than it took to create I'm sure). I'd expect modern LLMs to be able to recreate it within a few minutes as a one-shot task.)
qingcharles 1 hours ago [-]
The ones I can mention.. one that watches a specific web site until an offer that is listed expires and then clicks renew (happens about once a day, but there is no automated way in the system to do it and having the app do it saves it being unlisted for hours and saves someone logging in to do it). Several that download specific combinations of documents from several different portals, where the user would just suck it up previously and right-click on each one to save it (this has a bunch of heuristics because it really required a human before to determine which links to click and in what order, but Claude was able to determine a solid algo for it). Another one that opens PDFs and pulls the titles and dates from the first page of the documents, which again was just done manually before, but now sends the docs via Gemma4 free API on Google to extract the data (the docs are a mess of thousands of different layouts).
scottyah 1 hours ago [-]
I have one that serves a few functions- Tracks certificates and licenses (you can export certs in any of the majorly requested formats), a dashboard that tells you when licenses and certs are close to expiring, a user count, a notification system for alerts (otherwise it's a mostly buried Teams channel most people miss), a Downtime Tracker that doesn't require people to input easily calculatable fields, a way for teams to reset their service account password and manage permissions, as well as add, remove, switch which project is sponsoring which person, edit points of contact, verify project statuses, and a lot more. It even has some quick charts that pull from our Jira helpdesk queue- charts that people used to run once a week for a meeting are just live now in one place. It also has application statuses and links, and a lot more.

I'd been fighting to make this for two years and kept getting told no. I got claude to make a PoC in a day, then got management support to continue for a couple weeks. It's super beneficial, and targets so many of our pain points that really bog us down.

CoolThings 11 minutes ago [-]
>> a dashboard that tells you when licenses and certs are close to expiring

Or, Excel > Data > Sort > by the Date column. No dashboard needed, no app needed.

shimman 2 hours ago [-]
It's almost always a CRUD app or dashboard that no one uses while being extremely overkill for their use case.

edit: LOL called it, a bunch of useless garbage that no one really cares about but used to justify corporate jobs programs.

girvo 1 hours ago [-]
Ah but it looks cool and I can put it on my stack ranking perf eval
hdndjsbbs 4 hours ago [-]
My team has also adopted this - it's much easier to add another layer than to refine or simplify what exists. We have AI skills to help us debug microservices that call microservices that have circular dependencies.

This was possible before but someone would maybe notice the insane spaghetti. Now it's just "we'll fix it with another layer of noodles".

vineyardmike 34 minutes ago [-]
That's so interesting because where I work, the push was to "add one more API" to existing services, turning them into near monoliths for the sake of deployment and access. Still a mess of util and helper functions recursively calling each other, but at least it's one binary in one container.
mancerayder 2 hours ago [-]
Unfortunately I saw this pre-AI with microservices, where while empowering developers with their beloved microservices, we create intense complexity and deployment headaches. AI will fix the slop with an obscuring layer of complexity on top.
layoric 2 hours ago [-]
Are you concerned this will just lead to coupling everywhere like microservices tend to do?
Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
I'm sorry to hear that you have people abusing their new superpowers.

I run a team and am spending my time/tokens on serious pain points.

casey2 4 hours ago [-]
Such as?
tonyarkles 1 hours ago [-]
I'll throw this out as something where it has saved literally weeks of work: debugging pathological behaviour in third-party code. Prompt example: "Today, when I did U, V, and W. I ended up with X happening. I fixed it by doing Y. The second time I tried, Z happened instead (which was the expected behaviour). Can you work out a plausible explanation for why X happened the first time and why Y fixed it? Please keep track of the specific lines of code where the behaviour difference shows up."

This is in a real-time stateful system, not a system where I'd necessarily expect the exact same thing to happen every time. I just wanted to understand why it behaved differently because there wasn't any obvious reason, to me, why it would.

The explanation it came back with was pretty wild. It essentially boiled down to a module not being adequately initialized before it was used the first time and then it maintained its state from then on out. The narrative touched a lot of code, and the source references it provided did an excellent job of walking me through the narrative. I independently validated the explanation using some telemetry data that the LLM didn't have access to. It was correct. This would have taken me a very long time to work out by hand.

Edit: I have done this multiple times and have been blown away each time.

Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
I answered this in a different comment below, but a lot of the friction is around the amount of time it takes to test/review/submit etc, and a lot of this is centered around tooling that no one has had the time to improve, perf problems in clunky processes that have been around longer than anyone individual, and other things of this nature. Addressing these issues is now approachable and doable in one's "spare time".
casey2 3 hours ago [-]
The point of that friction is to keep the human in the loop wrt code quality, it's not meant to be meaningless busywork. It's difficult to believe that you sustain the benefit of those systems. Anthropic and Microsoft publicly failed to keep up code quality. They would probably be in a better spot currently if they used neither, no friction, no AI. But that friction exists for a reason and AI doesn't have the "context length" to benefit from it.

This the the difference between intentional and incidental friction, if your CI/CD pipeline is bad it should be improved not sidestepped. The first step in large projects is paving over the lower layer so that all that incidental friction, the kind AI can help with, is removed. If you are constantly going outside that paved area, sure AI will help, but not with the success of the project which is more contingent on the fact that you've failed to lay the groundwork correctly.

girvo 1 hours ago [-]
For me/my team, I use it to fix DevProd pain points that I would otherwise never get the investment to go solve. Just removed Webpack for Rspack, for example. Could easily do it myself, which is why I can prompt it correctly and review the output properly, but I can let it run while I’m in meetings over more important product or architectural decisions
nathancahill 4 hours ago [-]
Creating stakeholder value
natpalmer1776 3 hours ago [-]
Promoting synergy
paradoxyl 2 hours ago [-]
Creating productivity gain narrtives
scottyah 1 hours ago [-]
Aligning stakeholders
serf 3 hours ago [-]
>Such as?

it's crazy that the experiences are still so wildly varying that we get people that use this strategy as a 'valid' gotcha.

AI works for the vast majority of nowhere-near-the-edge CS work -- you know, all the stuff the majority of people have to do every day.

I don't touch any kind of SQL manually anymore. I don't touch iptables or UFW. I don't touch polkit, dbus, or any other human-hostile IPC anymore. I don't write cron jobs, or system unit files. I query for documentation rather than slogging through a stupid web wiki or equivalent. a decent LLM model does it all with fairly easy 5-10 word prompts.

ever do real work with a mic and speech-to-text? It's 50x'd by LLM support. Gone are the days of saying "H T T P COLON FORWARD SLASH FORWARD SLASH W W W".

this isn't some untested frontier land anymore. People that embrace it find it really empowering except on the edges, and even those state-of-the-art edge people are using it to do the crap work.

This whole "Yeah, well let me see the proof!" ostrich-head-in-the-sand thing works about as long as it takes for everyone to make you eat their dust.

leptons 3 hours ago [-]
That's all well and good, but what happens when the price to run these AIs goes up 10x or even 100x.

It's the same model as Uber, and I can't afford Uber most of the time anymore. It's become cost prohibitive just to take a short ride, but it used to cost like $7.

It's all fun and games until someone has to pay the bill, and these companies are losing many billions of dollars with no end in sight for the losses.

I doubt the tech and costs for the tech will improve fast enough to stop the flood of money going out, and I doubt people are going to want to pay what it really costs. That $200/month plan might not look so good when it's $2000/month, or more.

nvader 2 hours ago [-]
Why not try it yourself? Inference providers like BaseTen and AWS Bedrock have perfectly capable open source models as well as some licensed closed source models they host.

You can use "API-style" pricing on these providers which is more transparent to costs. It's very likely to end up more than 200 a month, but the question is, are you going to see more than that in value?

For me, the answer is yes.

Jach 2 hours ago [-]
It's an important concern for those footing the bill, but I expect companies really in the face of being impacted by it to be able to do a cost-benefit calculation and use a mix of models. For the sorts of things GP described (iptables whatever, recalling how to scan open ports on the network, the sorts of things you usually could answer for yourself with 10-600 seconds in a manpage / help text / google search / stack overflow thread), local/open-weight models are already good enough and fast enough on a lot of commodity hardware to suffice. Whereas now companies might say just offload such queries to the frontier $200/mo plan because why not, tokens are plentiful and it's already being paid for, if in the future it goes to $2000/mo with more limited tokens, you might save them for the actual important or latency-sensitive work and use lower-cost local models for simpler stuff. That lower-cost might involve a $2000 GPU to be really usable, but it pays for itself shortly by comparison. To use your Uber analogy, people might have used it to get to downtown and the airport, but now it's way more expensive, so they'll take a bus or walk or drive downtown instead -- but the airport trip, even though it's more expensive than it used to be, is still attractive in the face of competing alternatives like taxis/long term parking.
Peritract 2 hours ago [-]
None of that is concrete though; it's all alleged speed-ups with no discernable (though a lot of claimed) impact.

> This whole "Yeah, well let me see the proof!" ostrich-head-in-the-sand thing works about as long as it takes for everyone to make you eat their dust.

People will stop asking for the proof when the dust-eating commences.

Gigachad 39 minutes ago [-]
We had a coworker vibecode an internal tool, do a bunch of marketing to the company at how incredible it is. Then got hired somewhere else.

I just went and deleted it because it's completely broken at every edge case and half of the happy paths too.

cobolcomesback 2 hours ago [-]
We’re seeing the exact same where I work. Our main Slack channels have become inundated with “new tool announcements!”, multiple per day, often solving duplicate problems or problems that don’t exist. We’ve had to stop using those channels for any real conversation because most people are muting them due to the slop noise.

And what’s worse is that when someone does build a decent tool, you can’t help but be skeptical because of all the absolute slop that has come out. And everyone thinks their slop doesn’t stink, so you can’t take them at their word when they say it doesn’t. Even in this thread, how are you to know who is talking about building something useful vs something they think is useful?

A lot of people that have always wanted to be developers but didn’t have the skills are now empowered to go and build… things. But AI hasn’t equipped them with the skill of understanding if it actually makes sense to build a thing, or how to maintain it, or how to evolve it, or how to integrate it with other tools. And then they get upset when you tell them their tool isn’t the best thing since sliced bread. It’s exhausting, and I think we’ve yet to see the true consequences of the slop firehose.

komali2 19 minutes ago [-]
> but sure do seem to help come promo time.

I personally noticed this. The speed at which development was happening at one gig I had was impossible to keep up with without agentic development, and serious review wasn't really possibile because there wasn't really even time to learn the codebase. Had a huge stack of rules and MCPs to leverage that kinda kept things on the rails and apps were coming out but like, for why? It was like we were all just abandoning the idea of good code and caring about the user and just trying to close tickets and keep management/the client happy, I'm not sure if anyone anywhere on the line was measuring real world outcomes. Apparently the client was thrilled.

It felt like... You know that story where two economists pass each other fifty bucks back and forth and in doing so skyrocket the local GDP? Felt like that.

fc417fc802 2 hours ago [-]
Sounds like a workplace wide DDoS.
jeremyjh 2 hours ago [-]
I'm sorry to hear you have such poor leadership.
trhway 3 hours ago [-]
>Barely an hour goes by without a new 4-page document about something that that everyone is apparently ment to read, digest and respond to, despite its 'author' having done none of those steps, it's starting to feel actively adversarial.

well, isn't that what AI can be used effectively for - to generate [auto]response to the AI generated content.

er2d 4 hours ago [-]
Im convinced none of these people have any training in corporate finance. For if they did they'd realise they were wasting money.

I guess you gotta look busy. But the stick will come when the shareholders look at the income statement and ask... So I see an increase in operating expenses. Let me go calculate the ROIC. Hm its lower, what to do? Oh I know, lets fire the people who caused this (it wont be the C-Suite or management who takes the fall) lmao.

dpark 4 hours ago [-]
Do you really think companies have started spending millions on tokens and no one from finance has been involved?

You could argue that all the spending is wasted (doubtless some is), but insisting that the decision is being made in complete ignorance of financial concerns reeks of that “everyone’s dumb but me” energy.

wjeje 1 hours ago [-]
What a finance team allocates on spend has nothing to do with what the tokens actually get used for.

Are they peeking over the shoulder of each team and individual? Of course not.

It can be the case that the spend is absolutely wasteful. Numbers don’t lie.

temp8830 3 hours ago [-]
> Do you really think companies have started spending millions on tokens and no one from finance has been involved?

Oh, they were involved all right. They ran their analyses and realized that the increase in Acme Corp's share price from becoming "AI-enabled" will pay for the tokens several times over. For today. They plan to be retired before tomorrow.

wjeje 2 hours ago [-]
That magic trick only works for publicly traded stocks.

Most firms are not a google or a Microsoft - a firms cash balance can become a strategic weapon in the right environment. So wasting money is not a great idea. Lest we forget dividends.

Moreover if you have a budget set re. Spend on tokens - you have rationing. Therefore the firm should be trying to get the most out of token spend. If you are wasting tokens on stuff that doesn’t create a benefit financially for the firm then indeed it is not inline with proper corporate financial theory.

dpark 2 hours ago [-]
Sounds like they did train in corporate finance.
wjeje 1 hours ago [-]
Sounds like you haven’t had training in corporate finance.
casey2 3 hours ago [-]
More that there is a poor incentive structure. Just like how PE can make money by leveraged buyouts and running businesses into the ground. Many of the financial instruments that make both that and the current AI bubble possible were legal then made illegal within the lifetimes of the last 16 presidents.

Round-tripping used to be regulated. SPVs used to be regulated. If you need a loan you used to have to go to something called a bank, now it comes from ???? who knows drug cartels, child traffickers, blackstone, russians & chinese oligarchs. Even assuming it doesn't collapse tommorow why should they make double digit returns on AI datacenters built on the backs of Americans?

dpark 2 hours ago [-]
My issue was not with criticism of the money being spent or how it’s being obtained. I was specifically commenting on this statement:

> “Im convinced none of these people have any training in corporate finance. For if they did they'd realise they were wasting money.”

This isn’t meaningful criticism. This is a vacuous “those guys are so dumb”.

BloondAndDoom 4 hours ago [-]
AI is truly perfect for internal tooling. Security is less or no concern, bugs are more acceptable, performance / scalability rarely a concern. Quickest way to get things done, and speed up production development, MVP development etc.
jdub 4 hours ago [-]
> Security is less or no concern

[waits for chickens to come home to roost]

connicpu 4 hours ago [-]
Doesn't take long until someone has the bright idea to pipe customer tickets directly into the poorly written internal tool
overfeed 4 hours ago [-]
> [waits for chickens to come home to roost]

"We are writing down X billions over 4 years, and have cancel several ambitious programs related to our AI experiments. We were following standard practice in the industry, so [shareholders] can't blame us for these chickens coming to roost. If everyone is guilty, is anyone really guilty?"

LPisGood 4 hours ago [-]
When attackers can move laterally through everything because every internal tool leaks credentials and data there will be issues.
2ndorderthought 3 hours ago [-]
No problems at all except, unauthorized access to a model they were claiming was a weapon and couldn't be released to the public and having their cli code leaked in the last two weeks. Everything's just fine
sumedh 3 hours ago [-]
Anthropic seems to be doing fine :)
4 hours ago [-]
cobolcomesback 3 hours ago [-]
This comment makes me want to scream.
amluto 3 hours ago [-]
I am, oddly, able to get really quite a lot of mileage out of $20/mo of OpenAI plan, and I have never encountered a usage limit. I have gotten warnings that I was close a couple times.

I wonder what I’m doing differently.

I did spend quite a bit of time, mostly manually, improving development processes such that the agent could effectively check its work. This made a difference between the agent mostly not working and mostly working. Maybe if I had instead spent gobs of money it would have worked output tooling improvements?

komali2 10 minutes ago [-]
I wonder if you're like me? I tried out the MCPs and sub agents and rules and bells and whistles and always just came back to a plain Codex / Claude Code / Cursor Agent terminal window, where I say what I want, @ a few files, let it rip, check the diff, ask for some adjustments, then commit and start the process over after clearing context.

Haven't found a process that beats this yet and I burn very few tokens this way.

se4u 4 hours ago [-]
I'd be interested to learn what kind of internal tooling are you improving ?
appplication 4 hours ago [-]
I’m not them but we have vastly improved our internal pipeline monitoring/triage/root cause/etc by having a new system that basically its whole purpose is to hook into all of our other systems and consolidate it under a single view with an emphasis on shortening the amount of time it takes to triage and refine issues.

This will have previously been too ambitious to ever scope but we’ve been able to build essentially all of it in just two months. Since it sits on top of our other systems and acts as more of a window/pass through control pane, the fact that it’s vibe coded poses little risk since we still have all the existing infrastructure under it if something goes awry.

TimTheTinker 4 hours ago [-]
Personally, a static analysis PR check to catch some types of preventable runtime production errors in application code
Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
We've had a lot of complaints about our review processes, time to submit, etc, and a lot of that boils down to tools no one has time to improve.

It's now trivial to fix these problems while still doing our day jobs -- shipping a product.

hellisothers 4 hours ago [-]
Same and it is working really well (I say contra to most individual reporting).
andriy_koval 4 hours ago [-]
I have some coworker who says something similar, he vibe coded tons of cryptic code, which indeed solves some problem though could be way more compact and well structured. Now it is hitting complexity limitation, since llm now cant comprehend it, and human cant comprehend it by large a margin.
Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
honest recommendation: nuke and pave after analyzing (w/ AI of course) where it went horribly wrong.

it's trivial to reimplement a better solution.

andriy_koval 4 hours ago [-]
Its a bit of workspace politics, I would need to call that guy out to tell that he is not hyper-performer, but just pushed lots of low quality code which will produce lots of negative impact in a long term.

Also, I am not sure if it is trivial to implement. The code is injected into many scenarios and workflows, so replacement will be painful and risky if new solution break some edge case.

Jagerbizzle 4 hours ago [-]
It sounds like you might have some larger process problems if someone can just inject a bunch of vibe-coded slop into critical workflows while more discerning eyes are dubious of the quality/reliability etc.
SpicyLemonZest 3 hours ago [-]
In some sense, sure. There’s a lot of processes that weren’t previously needed, because sloppy people who couldn’t or wouldn’t think things through were mostly incapable of producing PRs that passed all the existing tests.
andriy_koval 3 hours ago [-]
its partially/largely management problem. One of tier1 productivity metric in the group is # of LoC created by engineers, so it creates dynamics of people exchanging favors of pushing AI slop to codebase, or be labeled as low performers.
2ndorderthought 3 hours ago [-]
The problem was definitely because they didn't use enough AI fast enough. They should just try again
vbezhenar 4 hours ago [-]
Just wait a month, Opus 4.8 will comprehend it for sure.
overfeed 3 hours ago [-]
it will comprehend it well enough to complicate it further into a rats-nest that only Opus 4.9 can comprehend, and so on. Good luck if you run into a bug before the N+1 version launches.
bakugo 4 hours ago [-]
I guess that's one way to tout a technology as revolutionary without actually needing to provide any proof of it. Just say you're using it for "internal tooling" and "unannounced projects", that way nobody can look at them and notice they're indistinguishable from the slop that clogs up Show HN nowadays.

It's better than the "here's my code, it a giant pile of spaghetti but only luddites care about code quality and maintainability anyway" method, at least.

xtracto 4 hours ago [-]
Haven't you seen all the layoffs? Ive been subscribed to r/layoffs for 5+ years, and since a couple of months ago, it's been crazy noisy.

My hypothesis is that companies dont want to offer cheaper nor better services. Only want to cut costs and keep the revenue for investors.

I other news, TQQQ is pretty high!

adrithmetiqa 4 hours ago [-]
Subscribers will not enable these companies to make their money back. The only way is for them to eat the economy itself
hmaxwell 4 hours ago [-]
I'm wondering whether the layoffs are partly targeting people who haven't adapted to using AI tools, particularly those who are openly dismissive of AI-assisted work.
dieortin 3 hours ago [-]
That’s like firing someone because he uses vim instead of VSCode. Who cares about the tools someone uses if he still does his job well?
psadauskas 4 hours ago [-]
I'm spending a ton of tokens because it insists on manually correcting code that fails the linter, despite the instructions in the AGENTS.md to run the linter with autocorrect.

And also because the Plan agent generates a huge plan, asks me a couple yes/no questions with an obvious answer, and then regenerates the entire plan again. Then the Build agent gets confused anyway and does something else, and I have to round-trip about 5 times with that full context each time.

johanneskanybal 2 hours ago [-]
It's a great tool, and at 1/10 or 1/100th the cost of actual developers. In the context of yc I guess watch out getting re-disrupted by a smaller team faster than before. But that's really the trend the past 40 years so nothing is new. Well maybe the velocity combined with us loosing it's footing at the same time.

But yea it's not gonna make facebook 20% better tomorrow just that you need 5 people instead of 40 to build the next facebook.

rnxrx 2 hours ago [-]
It's not just code generation, either - more and more people in my own org are using Claude Code for infrastructure automation, devops, etc. Obviously some amount of code in there, but an absolute ton of tokens being consumed just dealing with Kubernetes work at scale.
jonlucc 4 hours ago [-]
I can say in one role in my job, I'm getting a lot of use and I know my colleagues are at least trying a lot of things. One use is a first-pass review of animal care and use protocols. The Claude project was given all of the relevant policies and guidelines as well as a fairly long prompt that explains the things we look for in protocol review. It's checking some things that the software we use makes very tedious to check and raising inconsistencies between sections. Some places have a full time "protocol reader" who does this kind of first check, but we've never had that, so it's helpful.

Another project I'm seeing in the same realm is taking an approved protocol and some study results and checking that the records of what was done match what they said they could do in the approved protocol. It can also make sure that surgical records have all the things they should have. This can help meet one of the requirements from the national accreditation organization to do "post approval monitoring".

Another way I've used it is to have it collate and compare a particular kind of policy across many institutions who transparently put their policies online. Seeing the commonality between the policies and where some excel helped me rewrite our policy.

This is work that just wasn't happening before or, more accurately, it was being spread over lots of people, and any improvement in efficiency or consistency is hard to measure.

pizzly 3 hours ago [-]
For myself, its a massive boost when solo developing. Perhaps this is a different use case than most. It can work across multiple programming languages and frameworks that I had zero experience in. I use my existing knowledge of programming to ensure the new code written is correct. Also it really excels at translating from one language/framework to another. I can spend time getting it working well in a platform I know then just ask it to convert to another platform. It gets it 90% right in the first prompt, then its just a matter of fine-tuning, reviewing etc. This last 10% is where I supercharge my learning on those languages/framework. To lean all the new languages and frameworks would have taken me months before I would be productive. Now with a single prompt, we get 90% of the way there. That is incredible value for us.
_puk 4 hours ago [-]
I keep seeing this take.

And yet.. building shit is no longer the sole domain of the software engineer.

That's the sea change.

I've literally had finance and GTM stand things up for themselves in the last few weeks. A few tweaks (obviously around security and access), and they are good to go.

They've gone from wrangling spreadsheets to smooth automated workflows that allow them to work at a higher level in a matter of months.

That's what all this AI is doing. The shit we could never get the time to get around to doing.

er2d 4 hours ago [-]
So... more 'busy work'.

The only thing that matters is the impact on the financials. The shareholders (the people who employ you) dont care about any of this if it does not enhance value.

uncivilized 4 hours ago [-]
Mind sharing what industry you’re seeing this in? I’ve never talked to finance or GTM as an engineer. I’m not sure GTM exists in my industry.
bgun 4 hours ago [-]
You seem to be under the impression that making services better or cheaper _for the consumer_ is the goal of any corporation. The goal is to make their own operations better and cheaper for them. They are laying off employees and adding features of questionable value as a pretext to raise prices. The playbook has not changed, it has only accelerated.
trhway 3 hours ago [-]
>What is all this AI doing? People are spending 10’s to 100’s of billions and no service or technology seems better or cheaper. Everything is more expensive and worse.

That "more expensive" is someone's revenue. May be AI is the kind of technology that allows to make more and more revenue by making things more expensive and worse than by making them better and cheaper.

inquirerGeneral 3 hours ago [-]
[dead]
iLoveOncall 5 hours ago [-]
Run-rate revenue is not ARR. For all we know they could have a revenue of $100 and claim a run-rate revenue of $30B.

Given the fact that both Altman and Amodei are pathological liars, there's absolutely no reason to believe that Anthropic has $30B ARR.

senordevnyc 5 hours ago [-]
For all we know they could have a revenue of $100 and claim a run-rate revenue of $30B.

Can you explain how that’d work? What would the $30B figure be based on if they only have $100 in revenue?

nilkn 5 hours ago [-]
They're pointing out that run-rate revenue is based on essentially sampling revenue over some limited time interval, then extrapolating from there assuming revenue always occurs at the same rate (or greater) over all similar intervals in the future. More specifically, they're pointing out that estimates of ARR derived from this kind of sampling are fundamentally prone to error and can be arbitrarily inflated based on how the time interval is sampled.
sisve 5 hours ago [-]
As far as I understand run rate revenue is just a fancy way of saying that "the last month we had sales, and if that continues for a year we will have a AAR of 30B. meaning it's not 30B yet, but the sales numbers indicates that we get there by continue selling at the current speed. But to have revenue of $100 and get $30B in ARR I guess the period looked at needs to be seconds....

(Run Rate = Revenue in Period / # of Days in Period x 365)

iLoveOncall 3 hours ago [-]
Not even that. It's not based on actual sales in, for example, the past month. It's based on an expected continuous growth based on the growth of the past month (or whatever period you pick).

It's a forecast.

DavidSJ 5 hours ago [-]
There are about 30 million seconds in a year. If they made $100 over the last hundred milliseconds, then that’s $30B annualized.

(That said, their numbers are much realer than that.)

maplethorpe 4 hours ago [-]
If you make a hundred dollars in 0.1 seconds, you could say your annualized revenue is $100 / 0.1 * 60 * 60 * 24 * 365 = -$30 billion.

That said, most people would use a monthly or quarterly period to estimate ARR. I'm not sure what Anthropic used. Probably monthly.

3 hours ago [-]
5 hours ago [-]
siva7 5 hours ago [-]
the fact!?
applfanboysbgon 4 hours ago [-]
I don't follow Anthropic closely enough to know what claims its CEO has made, but it is factual that Altman is a pathological liar. You can observe this for yourself by reading and listening to the things he says and then comparing them to reality. We have years of evidence to look back on. The chasm between Altman's reality and everyone else's is so large and so well-known that it was one of the chief factors cited by the board when he was fired.

(I would then argue that he was re-hired specifically because others involved with OpenAI understood that it is literally his job to lie and that OpenAI would not be where it is today as a corporate behemoth rather than a research non-profit without a world-class liar marketing it, but that is merely conjecture.)

kllrnohj 4 hours ago [-]
I mean.. kinda everything about Mythos for example? Anthropic has a good product, but they also pretty consistently say some stupid ass shit if you're being generous, and blatant lies if you aren't
Danox 12 minutes ago [-]
Stand clear of the blast crater not everyone in tech bought the con…
mrandish 3 hours ago [-]
> suddenly model quality is back up again.

I agree about the core motivation behind these deals, however I'm skeptical as to how "suddenly" we'll see substantial improvements. Despite their size, I'd be surprised if Google or Amazon had uncommitted chunks of Anthropic-scale, top-tier AI compute sitting around waiting to be activated.

They're already over-subscribed and waiting for new data centers (and power plants) to come online. I suspect Anthropic will get a modest amount of new capacity right away with more added over coming quarters. These two deals don't change the total amount of AI compute available on planet Earth over the next 18 months. Anthropic parting with high-value equity has now made them the new highest bidder for an already over-bid resource. I suspect the net impact will be Amazon & Google pushing prices even higher on everyone else as they reallocate compute to their new top whale.

HWR_14 3 hours ago [-]
> Despite their size, I'd be surprised if Google or Amazon had uncommitted chunks of Anthropic-scale, top-tier AI compute sitting around waiting to be activated.

I doubt it was idle capacity. But for a chunk of equity in Anthropic I imagine they are willing to deprioritize other, possibly internal, uses. Certainly anything that's not contractually obligated could be on the chopping block.

data-ottawa 4 hours ago [-]
It takes me 6 minutes minimum to get a response in the last 3 days, I don’t think model capacity is better.
__turbobrew__ 1 hours ago [-]
It seems like they shifted heavily to prioritizing enterprise users. Starting in the last day or two I started getting much faster responses on an enterprise plan.
Sol- 4 hours ago [-]
Perhaps the adversity of the contracts cancels out with their sudden success and increase in valuation and it ends up a wash compared to the counterfactual scenario where they would have speculated on high growth early on.
ux266478 2 hours ago [-]
They should probably look at moving away from general purpose hardware for their actual products, and reserve GP hardware for RnD. You don't need frontier nodes to run circles around GPGPUs, an ASIC made with 28nm is more than enough to embarrass an H100 (and much cheaper)

AI is in such desperate need to adopt software-hardware co-development practices, it's infuriating watching the industry drag its feet about it. We are wasting so much electricity and absolutely wrecking the "free" market just because these companies are incentivized to work at an unsustainable breakneck speed in getting shit to market.

3 hours ago [-]
scoot 2 hours ago [-]
> suddenly model quality is back up again

Is that not down to this? https://www.anthropic.com/engineering/april-23-postmortem

elAhmo 3 hours ago [-]
You really think that for companies of this size, signing a contract would immediately reflect in you as end user noticing improved model quality?
Onavo 5 hours ago [-]
Well to a certain extent it also blunts competition, Gemini is less of a threat if their main investor is also backing Anthropic. The issue is when the pyramid scheme collapses...
ValentineC 5 hours ago [-]
Both Amazon and Google provide the Claude models via their Kiro and Antigravity IDEs respectively. It could also be investing in their attempt to own the IDE space.
inquirerGeneral 3 hours ago [-]
[dead]
ordinaryradical 6 hours ago [-]
It feels like the market is full Wiley Coyote on frontier model makers, and I like Anthropic's B2B business model.

But all progress points to a commodification of foundation models--Google first named it as "we have no moat, neither does anyone else." So there must be some secondary play driving this, right? Hardware sales? Hedging for search ad revenue?

Still feels mispriced. I think asset inflation leaves too much money desperate for the Next Big Thing.

zaphar 6 hours ago [-]
Google does have a sort of temporary moat. They have a much better hardware supply line story than anyone else and the revenue to maintain that edge indefinitely.
htx80nerd 3 hours ago [-]
This is the thing - Google is a real company with well established business, money of their own, hardware, server farms, etc. ChatGPT and Anthropic have none of that in the same way google does. They have an incentive to lie and 'fake it till you make it' so they can get out of the 'risk zone' of collapsing back in on themselves. Google can throw money at Gemini all day.
flockonus 3 hours ago [-]
That may be true for OpenAI, less so for Antropic - which has much better margins. Both of these companies CEOs have come in public saying the same.

No doubt as of currently Google has a better business. But the same argument could have been said about Instagram or Whatsapp before Facebook (now Meta) acquired them.

nostromo 5 hours ago [-]
Running AI at a loss long enough to kill the competition would run afoul of antitrust laws. Even more so since they’re bundling their AI products with their search monopoly.

Although I doubt this will stop them if they think it’s advantageous…

akozak 5 hours ago [-]
Lower real operating costs isn't the same thing as below cost pricing.

US law here is nuanced. Good quick primer https://www.ftc.gov/advice-guidance/competition-guidance/gui...

Bewelge 5 hours ago [-]
I thought that these type of antitrust laws are in no way enforced anymore in the tech industry. And that it's been that way for decades. I mean the sheer existence of Google shows that right? What about Maps, Mail, Books... basically everything apart from Search? Why would an AI Mode as one category of Search results be any different? They're not actively promoting Gemini in those search results. They're simply augmenting it with this new tool that exists now.
er2d 5 hours ago [-]
Yes anti-trust is very much theatre nowadays.

As long it further's American interests globally - monopoly is fine. Other countries need to take notice and start picking winners nationally in order to compete with the large American big tech firms.

Bewelge 5 hours ago [-]
Eh, I think this is actually not a specifically American thing. More of a neo-liberal mindset. Competition may be good in the long term. But a monopoly now may mean more money in your pocket now. The tech giants definitely give the US some geo-political power in some cases but in general the US would be better off with more competition.

ed: @er2d, can't reply to your comment for some reason, so doing it here: I don't agree. In theory a monopoly decreases the necessity for R&D. Of course this becomes more complex if the R&D is funded or steered by the state. But look at the current state of LLMs. There is fierce competition between 3 US companies. But geopolitically it's the same as if there would be one monopoly. The US being the clear technological leader in an industry is not dependent on that industry being a domestic monopoly.

And for the Europe comment: Also don't agree. Look at Boeing & Airbus. Both are companies where the US & EU have decided that they need to ensure the existence of a domestic airplane manufacturer. So in these cases they support these companies (often in violation of international trade laws). But it has nothing to do with monopolies. If a state decides to support a company to ensure its existence, a monopoly is the logical consequence and not the aim. Because if that industry would be profitable it wouldn't need to be supported in the first place.

But all these tech companies are not in industries that would move off-shore or stop existing because they're not profitable enough, so it's an entirely different setting.

er2d 4 hours ago [-]
Nope the reason for a monopoly is incentives for R&D and innovation.

The US understands that and allows it to happen as the former yields a compounding effect of power.

European states certainly don't get this.

SJC_Hacker 5 hours ago [-]
TSMC ?

Airbus ?

er2d 4 hours ago [-]
Are you claiming they are tech firms in the manner of a Apple, Google etc?

lol

klabb3 5 hours ago [-]
> run afoul of antitrust laws

Now, that’s a name I haven’t heard in a long time.

randito 4 hours ago [-]
> antitrust laws. Even more so since they’re bundling their AI products with their search monopoly.

couldn't this just be framed / spun as just using search data as training? i don't seem being bundled enough to run afoul with anti-trust.

nyc_data_geek1 5 hours ago [-]
Who's going to enforce antitrust laws in this environment, pray tell?
Sohcahtoa82 4 hours ago [-]
> Running AI at a loss long enough to kill the competition would run afoul of antitrust laws.

Running at a loss long enough to kill the competition is basically the name of the game these days.

When Uber started, they were basically setting VC money on fire by selling rides at a loss to destroy the taxi market.

pixl97 5 hours ago [-]
>would run afoul of antitrust laws

Buwahahahahahahahhahah

They drop a little cash on some shitcoin the president controls and those problems go away.

5 hours ago [-]
5 hours ago [-]
JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
If AI is commoditising, who is Bahrain and who are the Saudis?
nostromo 5 hours ago [-]
The company with the access to cheap and plentiful energy and the real estate to build data centers will be Saudi Arabia in your analogy.

This is why SpaceX could be a dark horse in this race. Putting compute in space is expensive but so is building a data center in the US.

bpye 4 hours ago [-]
> Putting compute in space is expensive but so is building a data center in the US.

You know what's also really hard in a vacuum? Dissipating heat.

JumpCrisscross 4 hours ago [-]
> You know what's also really hard in a vacuum? Dissipating heat

Correct. The economics of space-based DCs comes down to permitting delays versus radiator mass.

At ISS-weight radiators (12 to 15 W/kg (EDIT: kg/kW)), you need almost decade-long delays on the ground (or 10+ percent interest rates) to make lifting worthwhile. Get down to current state-of-the-art in the 5 to 10 W/kg (EDIT: kg/kW) range, however, and you only need permiting delays of 2 to 3 years.

If there is a game-changing start-up waiting to be built, it's in someone commercialising a better vacuum-rated radiator.

ambicapter 4 hours ago [-]
Would you want more wattage per kg for a better radiator?
3 hours ago [-]
JumpCrisscross 3 hours ago [-]
Yes! Thank you–fixed.
redanddead 4 hours ago [-]
Putting it centrally globally makes a lot of sense, just like connecting airports

Saudi will host the biggest data centers in the world

mikelitoris 5 hours ago [-]
What does that mean?
JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
> What does that mean?

I really couldn't have been more obscure, could I? :P

In 1932, "the first oil field in the Persian Gulf outside of Iran" was discovered in Bahrain [1]. (The same year Saudi Arabia announced unification [2].)

In the end, Saudi Arabia had larger reserves and wound up geopolitically dominating its first-moving rival. In commodities, the game tends to be scale in part through land grabbing. Less who got where first.

To close the analogy, if AI does wind up commoditised, the layers at which that commodity is held are probably between power and compute [3]. So if AI commoditises (commodifies?), Google selling computer (and indirectly power) to Anthropic and OpenAI is the smarter play than trying to advantage Gemini. (If AI doesn't commoditise, the opposite may be true–Google is supercharging a competitor.)

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahrain_Petroleum_Company

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proclamation_of_the_Kingdom_of...

[3] The alternate hypothesis is it's at distribution.

mh- 5 hours ago [-]
I believe they were drawing a parallel to oil commoditization, but that's as far as I got.
Urahandystar 5 hours ago [-]
The app layer is Bahrain.
catlover76 5 hours ago [-]
[dead]
mhitza 5 hours ago [-]
I haven't thought about any secondary play, but if these companies converge on Google's TPUs, they would probably eagerly slice from NVIDIA's current market.

> In September 2025, Google is in talks with several "neoclouds," including Crusoe and CoreWeave, about deploying TPU in their datacenter. In November 2025, Meta is in talks with Google to deploy TPUs in its AI datacenters.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensor_Processing_Unit

dzhiurgis 4 hours ago [-]
I keep getting notification from my tooling that gemini models are overloaded so we switched you to openai. So I feel google is not ready to sell tpu’s just yet.
kranke155 4 hours ago [-]
We have no moat could be a bad assessment. First, the models have personalities, and that matters. I like talking Claude better. OpenAI is really different from Grok. The ai models are an extension of the main concern of the company they’re in.

Also those personalities, quirks and choices accumulate. A lot of people talk about using Claude Code and Codex for different things. This is 100% my experience. Some people make better models, but on the top 3, there are often differences that are fixed only by switching between them. If I feel the need to switch between them, then there are significant enough differences and those differences will accumulate.

iamdelirium 5 hours ago [-]
"we have no moat, neither does anyone else." is just an employee's personal work blog
onlyrealcuzzo 2 hours ago [-]
You don't need a moat if you're selling shovels and everyone's digging holes.
UltraSane 4 hours ago [-]
YouTube is a kind of moat for Google.
gverrilla 4 hours ago [-]
Interesting. Wanna expand?
UltraSane 4 hours ago [-]
It is the biggest collection of video to train LLMs on.
zmmmmm 4 hours ago [-]
It feels like Anthropic is everybody's insurance policy against someone else winning the AI race. So you have Amazon, Google, Microsoft basically every major tech company pushing their own tech hard but simultaneously ensuring they have a survival level stake in Anthropic if they can't build or acquire their way to stay at frontier level performance themselves.
consumer451 5 hours ago [-]
It is very difficult for me to see any amount of money being thrown at Anthropic as a bad idea.

The amount of new revenue that I am personally able to create for my clients, using Claude models for dev, and Claude models inside the insanely agile products delivered, is astounding.

If I was not currently experiencing this myself, and someone told me that this was possible, I would be calling them names.

zakisaad 5 hours ago [-]
You could say the same about Codex (and other tooling). Opus as a model is market leading (trading blows with the greatest that OpenAI is peddling), but there will be a reckoning when open weight models are good enough - and I'd argue we are almost there with some of the latest releases. If you hook up the latest OpenAI models to something like OpenCode, its a taste of what an open harness with a powerful model (outside of a providers ecosystem) will be able to offer developers in the future.
consumer451 4 hours ago [-]
I know there are multiple paths at this, thank the computing gods.

If we get to an end-state of monopoly/duopoly at this game, then we are truly screwed.

I was just stating my current use and revenue path. Anthropic has insane velocity, in April of 2026.

neya 2 hours ago [-]
> when open weight models are good enough

I think Deepseek is already there.

ManuelKiessling 3 hours ago [-]
Would you mind sharing what you can and want about how the sausage is made? I would love to hear concrete cases where actual leverage is measurable. I‘m asking in good faith, not to attack your standpoint.
consumer451 2 hours ago [-]
I would happily do so on a 1:1, private level. See bio for contact.
james2doyle 3 hours ago [-]
You’re paying the subsidized cost. Those margins will shrink once the real bill comes due. I really think everyone will look back at this time as the golden area of cheap AI. We are already seeing the costs (and restrictions/limits) creep up with the Western models.
Petersipoi 3 hours ago [-]
I think the opposite. AI will get cheaper as models become more efficient and we solve the datacenter/energy problem. I bet 10 years from now AI, that is way better than what we have today, will be close to free.
jayd16 30 minutes ago [-]
Just like how cloud costs got cheaper and we solved the datacenter/energy problem over the past 10 years.
consumer451 2 hours ago [-]
> You’re paying the subsidized cost.

100% agree. I have been trying to tell everyone to build their ideas, and exploit this environment where 100B of VC money into OpenAI/Anthropic = some percentage of money invested into your idea. This is the golden era of building! The music is gonna stop soon. Build now ffs!

slopinthebag 4 hours ago [-]
Why do AI boosters like yourself all have the same writing style? Was the comment AI generated?

It's like insane hype marketing speak. "insanely agile products delivered" like huh?

consumer451 4 hours ago [-]
> Why do AI boosters like yourself...

I believe that I am more of an AI realist. The agentic dev tools are really helping me out, but if I could wave a magic wand to make AI go away for a hundred years, I would do it.

I really hope that we can all laugh at how wrong I was.

However, I believe that the horrors will likely outweigh the benefits. Our global society/political systems are not ready for Stasi as a Service, mass unemployment, or any of this impending crap storm.

keybored 4 hours ago [-]
Getting in on the astounding action before the world turns to shit.

Who could call me a starry-eyed idealist? I have invested in bunkers.

2 hours ago [-]
consumer451 2 hours ago [-]
lol. I have been a starry-eyed idealist all of my life. I would like to think that I still am.

I hate money.

You know what I hate even more? Being the supposed "smart one," and having to borrow money from my entire family to get through my health issues.

I will never do that again, hopefully.

anon84873628 3 hours ago [-]
To me it is more like software consultant speak than AI booster speak. And it is not exactly surprising that the people in a particular subculture all talk similarly.
slopinthebag 3 hours ago [-]
Well, I hear it from people who are regular devs and not consultants, although it's more common with people who aren't really working in the trenches anymore.

Like ex-developer turned PM who is now vibe coding everything they can and thinks it's the greatest thing ever.

xeromal 4 hours ago [-]
I'll trust someone who has an account since 2018 vs 71 days ago. Especially when your name already indicates you're biased.
quadrifoliate 4 hours ago [-]
I've had an account for a while too, and I do think that that GP comment has a style typical of "AI boosters" -- breathless, big on hyperbole, and low on detail.

To the GP: I'd like some details of these "insanely agile products". Is this insane agility reflected by your customers saying that they have a better, faster, more reliable product? How are you measuring this?

slopinthebag 3 hours ago [-]
Wym "trust"? What is there to "trust" with my comment? Huh?
SpicyLemonZest 4 hours ago [-]
It's like insane hype marketing speak because that is genuinely the difference from what it was like to develop software 6 months ago. You see many people using the same language, often in comments that are otherwise stylistically quite different, because many people are experiencing the same thing.

I get that it's tedious to sit on tech forums listening to an endless stream of people insisting that suchandsuch technology is world-changing. Many people and probably most people who say that are wrong. But sometimes the world really does change.

Peritract 2 hours ago [-]
> I get that it's tedious to sit on tech forums listening to an endless stream of people insisting that suchandsuch technology is world-changing.

It's tedious because the insistence doesn't seem to be matched by much observable change.

SpicyLemonZest 34 minutes ago [-]
There's substantial observable change pointing towards a universal software development speedup in the neighborhood of 2x. Much of it is internal company metrics, simply because it's meaningless in most enterprise contexts to count how much software is released. Things you can count, like the number of phone apps published, show the same pattern: https://techcrunch.com/2026/04/18/the-app-store-is-booming-a...
slopinthebag 3 hours ago [-]
It's "world changing" yet the world seems mostly the same other than the increasing enshittification of everything...
throwawaytea 6 hours ago [-]
If you added up all the major AI valuations, it's apparently worth more than products Americans constantly buy and rely on for their main life. So either AI is going to be involved in every Americans life to a large degree, and paying real money for, or these valuations are insanely wrong.
zmmmmm 4 hours ago [-]
there are plenty of people who basically believe this is the end of the human economy - there will be nothing left that isn't done by AI in the future. Even the bits left that humans do will be human facades on AI driven activity (like your hairdresser will be viewing you through AI powered glasses using AI powered scissors etc).

So from that point of view you can indeed look at it as the entire value of the economy should be invested into AI companies.

com2kid 4 hours ago [-]
That is ultimately where it is headed and has been headed for over 100 years now.

The question is when will we get there.

If the answer is tomorrow, money means nothing and none of these investments matter. If the answer is 30 years, well lots of money to be made up until the inflection point of machines being able to design, build, and repair themselves.

JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> it's apparently worth more than products Americans constantly buy and rely on for their main life

What are you counting in this category?

throwawaytea 5 hours ago [-]
There are countless examples, but let's say Ford. Worth $150 billion, $50 billion not counting debt.

My neighbors just gave Ford $60k. It'll be a while until my neighbor gives Anthropic $60k.

nmilo 4 hours ago [-]
Valuations are based on future expected earnings, not revenue. It cost Ford a lot of money to make that $60k car. The margins for AI companies are unknown but the market is pricing that they’ll be higher at one point. Not that they’ll attract more revenue from the average person.
KingMachiavelli 5 hours ago [-]
> My neighbors just gave Ford $60k. It'll be a while until my neighbor gives Anthropic $60k.

How much of that 60K does Ford actually keep? And how much will it be once BYD is allowed in the US? The forecast for Ford is pretty much only downwards, the possible upside on AI is huge.

If every company in the F500 starts spending $2000+ on AI credits per employee, then every consumer product will indirectly be funding AI companies. I think it's already the case that companies small enough to avoid/skip getting O365 or Google Suite subscriptions will pay for AI first.

Aurornis 3 hours ago [-]
> My neighbors just gave Ford $60k. It'll be a while until my neighbor gives Anthropic $60k.

AI company revenues aren't driven by consumer subscriptions.

The people doing $20 or even $200 per month plans for their side projects aren't driving the demand. It's going to be business customers spending $1000/month or more per developer and all of the companies feeding their business processes through the API like call centers, document processing, and everything else.

If you're thinking of AI companies as consumer plays you're only seeing the tip of the iceberg. We get cheap access to Claude because they want us playing with it so when it comes time for our employers to choose something we can all lobby for Anthropic.

operatingthetan 3 hours ago [-]
>when it comes time for our employers to choose something we can all lobby for Anthropic

They should stop messing with us then. Stealth model changes, threatening to take code away on the $20 plan, the list goes on.

JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
I guess I’m not surprised that if one “added up all the major AI valuations,” it’s more than any single consumer purchase or even most single companies.
AussieWog93 2 hours ago [-]
On the flip side, enterprise.

How many businesses are paying Ford $10 million per annum?

ai-x 5 hours ago [-]
Did you add Google, Meta, Apple, Amazon in that because more people consume from these firms than Ford
ipaddr 5 hours ago [-]
His neighbour isn't spending $60,000 on all of those together
_puk 5 hours ago [-]
Count the Fords on the street.

Now count the Amazon deliveries in a year on said same street. And next year, and the year after, and.. however long one keeps a Ford these days..

It's quite a scary thought exercise.

VirusNewbie 2 hours ago [-]
Ford probably made 3k profit on that car. Given the falling costs of inference, what are the chances your neighbor gives anthropic 3k in profit over the next few years? Not terribly bad.
dzhiurgis 4 hours ago [-]
At 20 year depreciation it’s $250 a month. Close to Anthropic’s $200 model. IMHO at this point a lot of developers would rather walk than code manually.
root_axis 4 hours ago [-]
Yeah, but $200 a month is not a sustainable price.
com2kid 4 hours ago [-]
Cable TV begs to differ. I grew up working poor and plenty of people around me dumped a lot of money into cable TV subscriptions, and $120 back in the late 90s is $240 now.

Computer costs keep collapsing. Image and audio generation is turned out to be less computer intensive than text (lol).

First company to launch 24/7 customized streaming AI slop wins!

throwawaytea 1 hours ago [-]
I think the poster was saying giving away the models for $200 isn't sustainable for the provider, not that a user won't pay $200 for the latest and greatest models.
dzhiurgis 4 hours ago [-]
Seems they are growing and model is overloaded. I suspect they’ll raise the prices.

$1k for a lot of developers here is totally worth it.

vovavili 3 hours ago [-]
At some point in American history you probably could have said the same about railroads.
UltraSane 4 hours ago [-]
The valuations on AI companies are a bet on them capturing enough of the $60 trillion annual wages paid to people to have a good ROI.
IncreasePosts 5 hours ago [-]
I'm not sure exactly what kind of point you are making but the valuations are at least nominally based on the expected value of the business far into the future and aren't comparable to, say, purchases done over a year despite both being denoted in dollars.
Ericson2314 4 hours ago [-]
Stocks vs Flows! You can't compare (as in subtract and check sign) $ and $/s!
nimchimpsky 5 hours ago [-]
[dead]
urba_ 6 hours ago [-]
I consider them competitors… This reminds me of Microsoft in 1997 investing $150 million in Apple, saving it from near bankruptcy
lanthissa 6 hours ago [-]
googles multiple businesses and gemini isn't the largest one.

anthropic is the anchor external customer of tpu's and nvidia is worth more than all of google. If tpu's actually breakout as a viable alternative over the next few years for multiple clients the business could easily be worth as much as search, maybe more.

nikcub 3 hours ago [-]
Google cloud also need to be able to offer Anthropic models on Vertex otherwise they just won't be competitive.

Microsoft is in the same boat with Azure.

shimman 2 hours ago [-]
Google Cloud also needs to show constant quarterly growth so what better way than simply buying it and fudging the numbers?
billisonline 6 hours ago [-]
> If tpu's actually breakout as a viable alternative over the next few years

Why haven't they broken out yet, I wonder, if they're more efficient for inference and LLM costs are now weighted towards inference over training?

zaphar 5 hours ago [-]
You essentially have to run in google to use them and that probably limits their ability to breakout. Anthropic might be doing this deal as a way to shore up their supply chain and cost of both inference and training by leveraging Google's hardware and chip manufacturing expertise.
ai-x 5 hours ago [-]
Several customers like Citadel, run TPUs in their own datacenters (closer to Exchanges)
lanthissa 5 hours ago [-]
every tpu thats been made is in use and sold at a high margin, demand is not the issue.
lanthissa 5 hours ago [-]
there are literally not enough tpu's on earth for them to break out, every tpu thats been made is in use, the spike in demand is recent and google has heavy competition for foundry space.
chris_st 5 hours ago [-]
Possibly because they just haven't been able to manufacture enough of them yet to be a viable business to others? They're fighting everyone else for foundry space and time.
altern8 6 hours ago [-]
If I remember correctly, Microsoft allegedly did that for the very selfish reason of looking better in terms of being a monopoly.
politelemon 5 hours ago [-]
Of course this is well known. Everything Microsoft does is for selfish capitalist reasons and everything Apple does is for altruistic philanthropic reasons.
kqp 4 hours ago [-]
They’re publicly traded for-profit companies, selfishness is literally the definition of both of them and it’s the farthest thing from a secret.
stavros 6 hours ago [-]
Rather than for the altruistic reason of saving a struggling fellow company?
hu3 4 hours ago [-]
> Microsoft in 1997 investing $150 million in Apple, saving it from near bankruptcy.

If only Apple could pass the favor forward. But no, they can't be bothered to invest even a single million in Asashi Linux to benefit their own hardware.

twoodfin 6 hours ago [-]
Google is right (I think) to invest in winning compute share from Nvidia over winning token share from other frontier model builders.
raincole 5 hours ago [-]
They are, but Google Vertex has been one of the official ways to use Claude since forever.
infecto 6 hours ago [-]
They already had a non trivial stake in Anthropic though?
SecretDreams 6 hours ago [-]
It just keeps the lights on for the whole industry.

The tech is great but valuations are out of control. It's cheaper to keep valuations high through these circular financing deals, rather than to allow for any deflation.

casey2 6 hours ago [-]
Anthropics erratic behavior is going to get Google regulated. This is "don't rock the boat" money. Google existentially needs AI for advertising.
kshacker 5 hours ago [-]
That was precisely my thought on seeing the news. I did not know about Google's existing entanglements with anthropic, but it seemed like a clear message - Do not panic on the money, do the work.
nubg 3 hours ago [-]
"Do not panic on the money, do the work." - sorry what do you mean by that?
kshacker 2 hours ago [-]
If you look at their recent actions, they all seem financial as if they have become the monopoly already and can do anything. Maybe it is driven by fear of going bankrupt

Example. Them doing a AB test where they remove Claude CLI from the 20$ pro plan ... they rolled it back now. Other rate limits where they publicly double your quota at NON peak times but lower it during peak quietly. These are tacky and signs of panic.

One such issue is experimentation. But when you see back to back issues, it looks odd.

warkdarrior 6 hours ago [-]
> Google existentially needs AI for advertising.

What's the explanation behind this? I am sure they use AI in their ad network (matching web sites with ad offerings, maybe generating ads automatically), but is there more to it?

crumby 5 hours ago [-]
I know AI companies are selling ad training into the models so the models know about your product. I'm not sure if that is what they were referring to, but it could be related.
cromka 5 hours ago [-]
Anyone else has an increasing feeling that all the AI hype is turning into a "Dot-Com Bubble x 2008 Credit Default Swaps" collab?
blueblisters 4 hours ago [-]
I feel the same until I’m reminded I’m paying Anthropic $100 every month for something that’s indispensable to me now and would probably pay a lot more. Very inelastic demand as long as competition is low at the frontier.
sethops1 3 hours ago [-]
I pay TMobile $100 a month but they aren't worth a trillion dollars.
vovavili 3 hours ago [-]
TMobile is effectively a monopolist in many US regions.
shimman 2 hours ago [-]
Still not worth a trillion dollars.
uncivilized 3 hours ago [-]
Are you paying that, or is your work paying for it?

If you’re using it for personal work, why is $100 worth it?

linsomniac 19 minutes ago [-]
>If you’re using it for personal work, why is $100 worth it?

I'm not who you were replying to, but:

My work pays for $100/mo Claude, I pay another $100 to bring it up to $200/mo level because:

    - Partly: I got in the habit back when work was only paying $20 and I was paying the $180.
    - It is not worth it to me to spend braincells trying to optimize my use to slip into the $100 plan, I give everything "Opus, effort max" and with the $200/mo plan I never run out ($100 I'll run out mid-morning).
    - I run a *lot* of experiments, including work-related and personal, to try to understand and improve my AI use skills.
    - I also use it for a lot of personal things, right now I'm using it to help me plan a backyard studio and ADU.
"ccusage" the past month says $1017.

edit: Formatting, ccusage

Aurornis 3 hours ago [-]
$100/month isn't much for developer tooling. If you add up how much I spend on hardware upgrades, other SaaS products like backup services, software licenses, and other things it's easy to justify $100/month for a powerful tool.

I pay for my own AI provider subscriptions because keeping work and personal strictly separated is important for me. I do know some people who secretly pay $200/month for Claude and use it at their job even though it's not approved. I do not recommend doing that, but it shows that some people value this for their work.

For developers earning more than $10K per month, spending less than 1% of salary on tooling to make the job easier is easy to justify.

shimman 2 hours ago [-]
I too spend over $100 on drugs that make me feel productive but actually am not.
auto 51 minutes ago [-]
I’ve been a copilot and ChatGPT subscriber for probably close to two years now, give or take a couple of months, and I had a trusted friend telling me for months to give Claude a try.

It took about two weeks of really running it through its paces, and constantly slamming against the limit on it to convince me I had to upgrade to at least the 100/month sub, and at this point I wouldn’t blink to bump that to the 200/month if necessary.

I 100% believe we’re in a bubble, and that this level of compute isn’t sustainable at this price point, but for as long as I have it, I’m going to run it at the redline.

I’m a solo dev working on a project that I’ve just gone full-time on, after about 1.5 years of part time work. It’s a codebase that I laid the groundwork in, and has very well established systems, standards, and constraints.

The work I’m using Claude to do is the exact work I would be doing myself, but it does it at somewhere in the neighborhood of 5-10x the pace I could have. I don’t know that I could get the same rate of production if I managed a team of 2-3 programmers. Right now, it’s literally almost perfect at taking my iterative suggestions, and implementing them at that accelerated pace.

Honestly the hardest part is dealing with the fact that at the end of the day, I have to understand this codebase perfectly (solo dev and all that), so I have to take in changes to it that are also 5-10x the rate my normal intuition would. But, again, the plus side is that it’s implementing them essentially exactly as I would have, as it has ~20k lines of code that I wrote to use as an example.

If I were to hire even one other programmer, I’d be paying well north of 5k/month, and I’d not only be managing a super computer programmer tool, but an actual human being as well. $100/month might as well be free comparatively.

djeastm 4 hours ago [-]
I think a lot of people suspect that, but no one is able to help themselves. Manias are a feature/bug of humanity.
0xbadcafebee 4 hours ago [-]
It's an actual bubble specific to AI. This investment is just another example of the bubble. Pre-2008, all the investment would be coming from banks. Post-2008, all the investment came from VCs... but VCs got tapped out, so AI companies went to bigger private capital. They tapped out all the private capital. So now they're making the rounds, making deals with any corporations left with tens/hundreds of billions in cash, because they're the only possible investors left. When all of them are tapped out, and without a release of pressure from the hardware market, the only investor left will be the government. After that it's kaplooie.

You'll notice that all the really big deals have fallen through, because they're based on promises and meeting objectives that can't be met. So it's likely that there will be really big writeoffs but not a huge implosion like 2001/2008. The real losers will be the retail investors who put all their money in a handful of stocks at ridiculous valuations.

uncivilized 4 hours ago [-]
Which big deals have fallen through?
mhitza 3 hours ago [-]
"Nvidia’s $100 billion OpenAI deal has seemingly vanished" https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2026/02/five-...

"Disney cancels $1B deal with OpenAI after video platform Sora is shut down: 'The future is human'" https://finance.yahoo.com/sectors/technology/articles/disney...

And if I recall correctly the AI datacenter deal isn'tdoing Oracle stock any favours.

littlestymaar 4 hours ago [-]
x oil shock (due to Ormuz).
nghnam 27 minutes ago [-]
I think Google is using this to put pressure on OpenAI, while also getting some extra upside—like a possible path to acquire Anthropic later. And honestly, this could turn out to be bad news for OpenAI.
stephc_int13 5 hours ago [-]
My opinion about this is that Google see it as a way to weaken OpenAI, and few other side benefits, including the option to acquire Anthropic.

And it may very well be bad news for OpenAI.

sumedh 3 hours ago [-]
> including the option to acquire Anthropic.

I have feeling that Dario is not the type of man who would want to be acquired and then have Google's CEO telling him what to do.

siva7 5 hours ago [-]
That boat has sailed off. Not even Google has the cash to buy a company valued at almost a trillion dollars.
stephc_int13 4 hours ago [-]
Maybe, I think there is a lot of uncertainty about valuations of AI labs in the near to medium future.

OpenAI crashing would be good news and bad news for Anthropic investors.

SJC_Hacker 4 hours ago [-]
Valued at a trillion by basically, no one who would actually invest anywhere close to that
charcircuit 4 hours ago [-]
You don't have to buy companies with cash.
com2kid 4 hours ago [-]
It'd be funny if Google offered 750m in stock + cash just to see what happened... :D

The drama on HN alone would last for days. Twitter would implode in on itself.

twobitshifter 2 hours ago [-]
OpenAI was created to counter the threat of Google controlling a possible AGI. What if we still end up in the same state in the end? Both Anthropic and OpenAI have abandoned any pretense of altruism at this point and find themselves overwhelmed bythe forces of capitalism.
thisisauserid 5 hours ago [-]
>> $10 billion now ... another $30 billion to follow if Anthropic hits certain performance targets...
spindump8930 7 hours ago [-]
Hopefully this money means more compute infrastructure to help Anthropic counter the efficiency changes that have created this perceived downtrend in claude quality.
palmotea 7 hours ago [-]
The puzzling thing is why Google would try to help with that. Aren't they competitors? Wouldn't they want their competitor to have problems?

It's more understanding for Amazon or Microsoft to make such an investment, because they're not as competitive in the model space.

bmurphy1976 6 hours ago [-]
There's always three:

   Google buys Anthropic.
   Microsoft buys Open AI (or vice versa depending on how things go).
   SpaceGrok buys Cursor, limps along in 3rd place.
   Meta is the last man standing, get's stuck with Oracle, dies.
And then hopefully some open source models save us from this nightmare before China commadatises everything.

Edit: I forgot Amazon. Who knows what they will do. They're the wildcard anyway.

_puk 5 hours ago [-]
OpenAI buying Microsoft.. I honestly think I'd like to see that.

Anything to invigorate the desktop.

Microsoft buying OpenAI.. 10 minutes later it's rebranded Copilot.. and.. nothing much changes in the world. Oh, except all the AI improvements are around Enterprise governance.

mchusma 6 hours ago [-]
Google owned 14ish percent of Anthropic before this investment, so presumably this could bring it up to as much as 25%?
michelb 6 hours ago [-]
Deepmind is heavily using Claude. This could help secure computing power.
tomrod 6 hours ago [-]
I'm not up to date, I think. How so?
morelikeborelax 7 hours ago [-]
What if Google can't compete? They don't want to be left behind and all this money being throw around is just nonsense anyway.
infecto 6 hours ago [-]
Google was already an investor in Anthropic but I don’t think they are truly competitors in this space.
littlestymaar 4 hours ago [-]
> the efficiency changes that have created this perceived downtrend in claude quality”

Why the euphemism? What Anthropic did was an aggressive degradation of their model to save compute, and it's not just “perceived downtrend”, Anthropic themselves have acknowledged the quality of service degradation.

xt00 6 hours ago [-]
At this point if you have cash or compute credits laying around in the tens of billions, better to hedge your bets than to find out the winner that took all was not you.
addaon 6 hours ago [-]
Unless none of the current crop of AI companies is “the winner,” either because a newcomer appears or the craze fizzles… in which case have $40B in the bank seems superior.
skizm 3 hours ago [-]
Weren't there reports of Anthropic's stock trading on secondary markets at $1T valuation recently? Now Google invests at a $350B valuation. I get valuations are often times just smoke and mirrors, but this seems like a pretty big disconnect. What's going on there?
nikcub 3 hours ago [-]
Amazon and Google get discounts because they bring more than just cash and help solve a very immediate problem for Anthropic

Great position to be in if you're Amazon and Google

mjuarez 3 hours ago [-]
There's always backroom negotiations going on with investments like these. Private valuations are normally hyped-up, and with the current batch of AI companies, 100x so.

I assume Anthropic said something like "We'll give you 3% of our company for $30B, since we're valued at $1T now! So cheap!", and Google immediately came back with "Hell no. We'll give you even more, $40B... but it's for 11% of the company. Take it or leave it." With all the issues they're having, what leverage does Anthropic have at that point?

Basically, Google made them an offer they couldn't refuse.

5 hours ago [-]
dwayne_dibley 5 hours ago [-]
$40B. Numbers mean nothing anymore
wirgil1 1 hours ago [-]
tech is the biggest sector in the world. We're seeing what happens when those war chests for rainy days get brought out
pcurve 5 hours ago [-]
Yup. You can actually buy several European airlines with that kind of money.

For example, you can buy KLM Air france for less than $3B.

It is a profitable business that does $30B in sales and $1B in profit. (and has been profitable since for the past 4-5 years)

Jabbles 3 hours ago [-]
nikcub 3 hours ago [-]
Airlines are down there amongst cinema chains and video game retail stores in terms of being terrible businesses
polski-g 13 minutes ago [-]
Want to know the easiest way to become a millionaire?

First, become a billionaire. Then, start an airline.

hayd 4 hours ago [-]
"$30B in sales and $1B in profit."

This margin seems terrible.

oscarcp 3 hours ago [-]
4% seems reasonable, it's pretty much standard across the board in Europe (median sits around 6% if I recall correctly), not many companies can pull 10% profit. For example in Spain, major conglomerates like INDITEX have a 11%, Iberdrola has a 10%. We also don't use the same metrics and parameters as the US for profit, so the values are skewed.

That said, certain sectors like software (as in custom enterprise grade software dev) pull revenues that are much much higher sitting around 35%, but it's not that common.

0xBA5ED 4 hours ago [-]
Yes, and it's incredibly wasteful.
mirekrusin 4 hours ago [-]
yep, you know what's better than billions? trillions.
ppqqrr 1 hours ago [-]
i intend to invest $40B in my wife's pottery business; she will invest the same amount in my uber-for-dogs AI SaaS startup. our GDP is gonna be wild.
6thbit 4 hours ago [-]
A 10B insurance policy on google’s business sounds like a bargain?

And with cashback through gcp usage!

Oras 7 hours ago [-]
They just announced their new chip, and they are the ones created transformers yet investing this amount in a competitor?

I don’t know what to make of it

pupppet 6 hours ago [-]
I wonder if Google regrets publishing that article on transformers.
jeffbee 5 hours ago [-]
Urs used to talk (internally) about not publishing "industry-enabling papers" which is why most Google infrastructure papers were describing something that had already been turned off, or was already in the process of being replaced by the next system (GFS, Vitess, etc). The things that did get published were either considered not key advantages, that other companies simply cannot do, things that other companies wouldn't bother doing, or experiments that never worked at all. There were exceptions of course. But it led to a public perception of the Google stack involving mostly technologies that were long dead or were never adopted.

"Attention Is All You Need" was a very very different thing and I also wonder if they are glad they published it. But I imagine if they hadn't, the motivation for researchers to leave Google would have been even larger.

sumedh 3 hours ago [-]
So Google allowed publishing the Attention paper because they didn't understand its value.
CamperBob2 2 hours ago [-]
They patented it. When the dumb money stops sloshing around, we'll start to see the fallout from that.
wirgil1 1 hours ago [-]
hedge your bets, I know I would
northern-lights 4 hours ago [-]
Why do you think Google considers Anthropic a competitor?
jeffbee 6 hours ago [-]
It makes every bit as much sense as investing in Snap while still operating their own social network product. Seems to have worked out fine (for Google, not Snap).
dzhiurgis 2 hours ago [-]
FWIW I’d buy SNAP now that they are at rock bottom
spwa4 6 hours ago [-]
Given that anthropic is probably paying it all back to them in compute bills, they may not be giving them anything.
Cyclone_ 2 hours ago [-]
This feels weird to me. Why wouldn't Google want to go all in on Gemini? Unless they feel anthropic is pretty far ahead with claude?
wirgil1 1 hours ago [-]
If you can get influence at your competitor you take it. It's valuable for both of them regardless
whatever1 5 hours ago [-]
Cool. Will they use their balance sheets to pour all of this cash or are they going to bring the banking system to its knees and then we bail out everyone again ?
shimman 2 hours ago [-]
I don't see why not. The US is bailing out foreign countries, might as well bail out unsustainable businesses too.
namegulf 7 hours ago [-]
So $40B in google cloud credits in return for % in equity.

Didn't Amazon AWS do the same recently?

ChrisArchitect 5 hours ago [-]
Anthropic takes $5B from Amazon and pledges $100B in cloud spending in return

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47848276

sega_sai 3 hours ago [-]
In the last couple of weeks, seeing all the announcements of new models by OAI, Anthropic and Chinese companies I was thinking if Google has something up their sleeve, but this news suggests otherwise.
dubeye 5 hours ago [-]
Google seems to own a bit of everyone.
airstrike 5 hours ago [-]
you might even say they own the whole alphabet at this point
dzonga 5 hours ago [-]
my take is Anthropic needs a large cash infusion since it's the one of the popular model providers.

if it runs of out of cash - then it's bad for the whole industry.

same as OpenAI. so all players - will provide cash & compute to keep them going.

sdevonoes 5 hours ago [-]
> if it runs of out of cash - then it's bad for the whole industry.

Why? I don’t think we would suffer if anthropic disappeared tomorrow

ares623 5 hours ago [-]
Google, Microsoft, Oracle, Meta, Nvidia. All their stock gains in the last 2 or so years were because of the AI hype. And who knows how much money the borrowed and promises they made on the assumption that their stock will continue to rise in the same pace for years to come. When one domino falls, they will follow. So they have every incentive to keep the music going for one of their "friends".
goolz 4 hours ago [-]
If Anthropic disappeared tomorrow due to running out of cash it would cause a great panic, no?
shimman 2 hours ago [-]
For who? A bunch of financiers that gamble with pension funds? The real panic is when they IPO and force 401Ks to buy into it.
andxor 59 minutes ago [-]
You're so naive. It's all a big game of domino.
slashdave 5 hours ago [-]
They need compute
cadamsdotcom 2 hours ago [-]
When they said we’d soon have a circular economy I didn’t know it’d be made up of investments in AI companies that will get fed right back into inference.
aucisson_masque 4 hours ago [-]
Is anthropic really that good when you got deepseel V4 that has a fraction of the cost and works just as good ?
dzhiurgis 4 hours ago [-]
I think their cli still leading for some reason.

Not sure if it’s going to be good enough to replace IDEs with neatly integrated superior models.

5 hours ago [-]
alfiedotwtf 54 minutes ago [-]
From a comment below:

> My main job isn't writing code but I try to keep Claude Code and OpenCode busy and churning away on something as close to 100% of the time as I can without getting in the way of my other priorities

I’ve seen many people say this the past few weeks i.e that their daily job now is no longer coding and has flipped to being a full Claude Feeder making sure its always churning.

As someone who uses Claude Code daily, I still find myself reading code and thinking more vs just shoveling coal as fast as I can into the Claude steam train. Am I doing things wrong?

gigatexal 6 hours ago [-]
"The Alphabet subsidiary is committing to invest $10 billion now, at a $350 billion valuation for Anthropic, with another $30 billion to follow if Anthropic hits certain performance targets, according to Anthropic."

this is insane. on the secondary market the valuation is 2-3x that. what gives?

panarky 6 hours ago [-]
Anthropic raised $30 billion at a $350 billion valuation (pre-money) in February.

Google's deal from prior rounds likely lets them buy in at the same valuation other investors get every round, so they're just getting the February valuation.

Amazon did almost the same thing last week, at the same valuation.

lanthissa 6 hours ago [-]
Googles giving them something thats a lot more scares to them then dollars, large volumes of chips quickly.

If you gave anthropic 10b cash they couldn't get chips in the 0-6mo timeframe at scale. Anthropic is suffering reputational damage due to choices they have to make around capacity constraints.

Google, AWS, and Azure are the only people who can help them so they hold the cards, thus the good terms.

manquer 5 hours ago [-]
The GOOG and AMZN deals announced earlier this week would be considered part of the same Feb'26 round. I.e. it would have the same seniority rights as that round.

It is not uncommon to keep a round open after the formal announcement for a bit so that few investors who could not close for whatever reason are part of it. It can be hard to line up everyone at the same time, especially when they are public companies.

---

Specific to your point on why valuation can be lower than market at the same time - Goods(and stocks) while feel to be homogeneous, divisible, fungible, they are not. Size can value of its own.

A block of 10% shares may be worth more (or less) than unit share price, because them being available together has a property of its own, making it either more desirable when someone wants to acquire or harder to sell because there is not enough demand if all of them get dumped at the same time [1]

In this deal terms, just cause few ten millions are trading at $850B, or some investors can put in say $1-2B doesn't mean you can raise $40B at the same valuation.

There isn't depth in the market to raise $65B (including the AMZN deal) at $850B valuation. There is always some demand at any price point in the demand supply curve, you will probably find few people who will buy few shares at $10T, or $100T or some ridiculous number but that doesn't mean you can raise a large round on that.

Strictly speaking it is not even $350B per se, i.e. Google and AWS benefit from this as vendors. It very much like vendor financing with convertible debt. Meaning it is worth that much to them, but not to you and me because we are not getting some of the money back as sales that boosts are own stock.

---

[1] In the same vein, price can also depend on what you are getting in return, hard immediate dollars is the highest value. However if you are getting shares in return, you can usually negotiate a premium depending on risk of the shares you are getting.

The recent SpaceX - Cursor deal is a good example, any founder would likely take say $10B all cash offer over the $60B from SpaceX, or price would be closer to cash if it GOOG, AMZN, APPL shares instead - proven deeply liquid market etc.

nly 6 hours ago [-]
Top of the book? Nobody on the secondary market is investing $30bn
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> Nobody on the secondary market is investing $30bn

Correct. But I think $5 to 10bn are sitting ready for $700 to 800, which strongly implies Google is getting a solid deal on this.

panarky 3 hours ago [-]
[dead]
Handy-Man 6 hours ago [-]
That's the last round they raised at. They had other offers from VCs at ~850B they rejected. Seems like may have been in works since that last round was being raised and just finished paperwork?
htrp 10 hours ago [-]
> Google is committing $10 billion now in cash at a $350 billion valuation and will invest a further $30 billion if Anthropic meets performance targets, the report said.

How much of this goes back to Google as cloud spend?

dmk 9 hours ago [-]
Google investing $40bn in a company that competes directly with Gemini is one of those moves that only makes sense if you think of it as buying compute customers, not backing a competitor. Anthropic pays Google for TPUs and Cloud services, a big chunk of this investment surely has to flow right back to Google.
bobkb 5 hours ago [-]
I wonder what happens to the “Gemini enterprise”. Will it do a Google plus or Google wave ?
wasting_time 2 hours ago [-]
Gemini seems more tailored towards information retrieval and product integration (including Android and even iOS via Apple's deal).

Google may reckon they can't (yet) reconcile their vision of Gemini with the raw coding performance of Claude and Codex.

zackho 1 hours ago [-]
great move by google
VirusNewbie 5 hours ago [-]
It's a little weird. I work for Google, but I spend way more time helping get Anthropic serving and running than anything to do with Gemini.
thatguysaguy 5 hours ago [-]
That's b/c the people working on Gemini serving are in GDM.
brcmthrowaway 5 hours ago [-]
This is a good strategy. Internal competition between Gemini and GCP.
dev1ycan 1 hours ago [-]
How many gigantic companies can join this before it crashes?
ecommerceguy 2 hours ago [-]
My AI use is significantly down. I'm sick of following Chat GPT "advise" only to learn how egregiously incorrect it is. Don't ask for DMV advice on registering an out of state car!
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
It’s pretty wild how badly Altman siding with Hegseth has backfired. (And how competently Dario has played his hand.)

I don’t think that’s the ultimate cause of the turnaround in fortunes. But it strikes me, at least from the investor and potentially urban-consumer perspectives, as a pivotal moment in both companies’ fortunes.

karmasimida 6 hours ago [-]
What backfired?

Ant's recent rise has little to none to do with retail subscribers, it is Claude Code with Opus 4.5+, followed by their Mythos stunt

I would say the flood of $20 Claude Subscribers due to news cycle backfired on them, now everyone is getting worse outputs and exposed their shortage on compute, which they can't fix anytime soon.

Pretty much everyone I know has both cc and codex now, just because how unreliable cc has become.

JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> would say the flood of 20+ Claude Subscribers due to news cycle backfired

This is a good hypothesis. I suspect we are both correct.

The PR boost from Anthropic standing its ground drove signups. That, in turn, drove investors. But the users also drove utilization, which degraded quality across the board.

My hypothesis rests on Anthropic’s user mix having significantly shifted to consumers (versus enterprise) after the mix-up. Whenever we get public numbers it would be interesting to test that.

afavour 5 hours ago [-]
> What backfired?

I think it was psychological to a degree. For many consumers OpenAI, or at least ChatGPT was AI. The controversy was enough for folks to be introduced to competitors in the AI space and suddenly OpenAI's success felt a lot less inevitable.

I agree with OP though that this won't actually be the cause of OpenAI's downfall, should it happen. But I still think it's an interesting inflection point.

karmasimida 5 hours ago [-]
> introduced to competitors in the AI space and suddenly OpenAI's success felt a lot less inevitable.

This is true. OpenAI WAS the story of AI, now it is just 50% of it, at max. Losing the monopoly of imagination towards AGI is bad for them.

One thing I don't agree though, consumers aren't the important part of AI, they are a liability.

AI is too expensive, consumers can't pay for it. Instead they will compete with enterprise for the same tokens, with less money.

JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
> controversy was enough for folks to be introduced to competitors

This is my suspicion. Consumers hadn’t previously heard of Anthropic and Claude. Now they had, particularly in cities.

> this won't actually be the cause of OpenAI's downfall, should it happen. But I still think it's an interesting inflection point

Also agree. Hence why I said “I don’t think” the fight is “the ultimate cause.”

pixl97 5 hours ago [-]
Anecdotally a whole lot more people around me started using Anthropic models in the last few weeks and seem to like them more than OpenAI. For many of these people it was the second provider they ever used.

Of course this is part of what has lead to such insane demand and outages they've experienced since then.

minimaxir 5 hours ago [-]
I use both CC and Codex because one is not enough and 5x for $100 is too much.
enraged_camel 4 hours ago [-]
>> followed by their Mythos stunt

"Stunt", eh?

danielbln 6 hours ago [-]
Alphabet makes $30 billion profit per quarter.
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> Alphabet makes $30 billion profit per quarter

Sure. Neither OpenAI or Anthropic do. Amazon and Google have followed institutional investors bidding up Anthropic over OpenAI in private markets, all of which—I suspect—followed user-pattern shifts following the fiasco. (Well, fiascos. Altman is a host unto himself.)

sevenzero 6 hours ago [-]
Which means they can allow themselves to blast money left and right? Its still a big investment.
kubb 6 hours ago [-]
they can't allow themselves NOT to blast money left and right
RobRivera 6 hours ago [-]
Yes
luke5441 5 hours ago [-]
No, they have a fiduciary duty to shareholders to not make obviously bad investments.
tomrod 6 hours ago [-]
It was enough for me to dig much deeper into OpenAI, where before we almost exclusively used them for services with any form of SLA.
ordinaryradical 6 hours ago [-]
You're saying it was a turning point for you to get more embedded with them? Way to be killer robot positive, I guess...
tomrod 5 hours ago [-]
Good call out because I was a little unclear.

Opposite of what you said. The "dig" was not retrenching to more use, but rather I evaluated what I saw them doing and have migrated our company to much better options.

infecto 6 hours ago [-]
Is the simpler explanation that Alpha was already an investor and Anthropic has been making strides in their business model?
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> Is the simpler explanation that Alpha was already an investor

Individually, yes. Anthropic surging in private markets the weekend after the supply-chain risk designation, and raising from not only Google but also Amazon in such short clip (following credibly reports of it turning down $800+ billion valuation cheques from financial investors), all while OpenAI gets pilloried in the press and struggles to hold its $800bn valuation in private markets, collectively—to me—paints a bigger picture.

infecto 6 hours ago [-]
Please share how OpenAI is struggling in the private markets.
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
There is more supply than demand flat to OpenAI’s recent raise. That’s simply not the case for Anthropic, at last raise or at comparable valuations.
infecto 5 hours ago [-]
Citation? Were you working on the deal?
JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
Can’t speak to citations, unfortunately, but if you have a banker or broker with secondary flow right now, ask them which they can get you more of and at what valuation: OpenAI or Anthropic.
er2d 5 hours ago [-]
"(And how competently Dario has played his hand.)"

lol hes barely done anything, but sometimes that is all that's necessary when a bozo opponent is hell-bent on screwing things up. He didn't get fired the first time for no reason.

JumpCrisscross 2 hours ago [-]
> hes barely done anything, but sometimes that is all that's necessary when a bozo opponent is hell-bent on screwing things up

An former chess instructor told me most games are won not by brilliant maneuver, but by not screwing up. Repeatedly making the boring play is a winning strategy far more often than any mastermind play.

sourcegrift 6 hours ago [-]
[flagged]
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
> your TDS

Wat?

pjl0 6 hours ago [-]
DESPERATELY trying to insinuate that the only possible reason to acknowledge that many people find distasteful the association between OpenAI and the desire for autonomous killbots MUST be that people are being unfair to Trump because of mental illness.
5 hours ago [-]
JumpCrisscross 6 hours ago [-]
Oh, Trump Derangement Syndrome. I found a utility in Wisconsin and was really trying to find the connection…

I guess to address the point, having a problem with Hegseth isn’t the same as having a problem with Trump. And given some of Trump’s administration is embracing e.g. Mythos, it seems unfair to characterize Dario v. Hegseth as anything broader.

There was a recent moment when OpenAI went from the uncontested darling of consumer and investing America, to being second place to Anthropic. It happened rapidly, and I saw it at least on the investor side in the weekend after the supply-chain risk designation. (Disclosure: that’s also the week I signed up for Claude, in part out of protest, but mostly to see what the fuss was about.) I think there is a lesson for anyone working with startups or in tech from this example—it may be one of the most violent strategic sea changes I’ve seen in a while.

lovich 6 hours ago [-]
He thinks you insulted his daddy somehow and is having a temper tantrum about it.
Forgeties79 6 hours ago [-]
I feel like there should be a rule on any forum that if somebody non-ironically uses “TDS” they should just get permabanned by a bot with no explanation.
JumpCrisscross 5 hours ago [-]
> they should just get permabanned by a bot with no explanation

I really like HN's system of flagging versus banning. Like, I genuinely mapped TDS to Trump Derangement Syndrome, something I wasn't doing before because I thought it was a joke versus something his supporters thought of seriously.

Forgeties79 4 hours ago [-]
I think we’d all be better off ignorant of it tbh
lovich 4 hours ago [-]
Accusing someone of TDS for anything short of complete subservience to Trump is a thought terminating sentence they use to protect their fragile egos and to try and darvo their way out of any legitimate position.
Forgeties79 3 hours ago [-]
I just can’t imagine reacting that way in the name of someone I don’t even know, let alone a politician.
lovich 56 minutes ago [-]
Its a cult. They are beyond reason at this point and working entirely off of emotions and now view the entire movement as part of their personality. That leads to feeling like they, personally, are being attacked whenever their leader is criticized.
themafia 6 hours ago [-]
Hegseth represents existing military priorities. The original comment presents the issue as if it's isolated to a single administrator.

It wouldn't call it TDS but it does project a severe political blind spot.

bluecalm 5 hours ago [-]
I find it crazy that Google considers Anthropic to be worth almost 10% of Google itself (350B valuation mentioned in the article). Anthropic gets traction but has no moat, no infrastructure and relatively small team working for it. I feel for 40B you can get a lot of very smart people and a lot of very good hardware to outcompete it.
chpatrick 13 minutes ago [-]
I think the very smart people already work at Google and the 40B buys some of the rest.
GoToRO 4 hours ago [-]
the moat is the tool itself. You understand this after you start using it.
sumedh 3 hours ago [-]
> You understand this after you start using it.

Its just amazing people that people talk about Anthropic and have never used it.

conradkay 4 hours ago [-]
> I feel for 40B you can get a lot of very smart people and a lot of very good hardware to outcompete it

Nah, see Meta

siva7 5 hours ago [-]
25% ;)
mkl 4 hours ago [-]
No, Google's market cap is $4.1T, over 10 times $350B.
forrestthewoods 5 hours ago [-]
10B at their valuation from last November is an absolutely killer deal. If Anthropic had sufficient compute supply they could raise at 2x easily if not 3x.
laweijfmvo 7 hours ago [-]
[dead]
gverrilla 4 hours ago [-]
[dead]
cmiles8 3 hours ago [-]
Regardless of if this is “vendor financing” or “circular financing” the history books are riddled with this sort of stuff ending very badly.

It’s concerning that the only thing that seems to be keeping the AI bubble inflated at this point is money from the folks selling things to AI companies. That’s very much not a good sign no matter how you spin it.

I’m a fan of AI and there’s clearly value to it… however that value seems completely out of whack with the money pumping into the ecosystem and at some point such irrational behaviors break.

keasHg 5 hours ago [-]
They need it to fend off Crabby Rathbun from watching YouTube videos and commenting. The paperclip race is on, and we must win it!
munk-a 6 hours ago [-]
Anthropic, meanwhile, is spending hundreds of millions buying customer commitments from PE firms to inflate that DAU number. They now have a larger war chest to spend on artificial user acquisition to further inflate that value for future funding rounds.
Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact
Rendered at 02:20:50 GMT+0000 (Coordinated Universal Time) with Vercel.