The fact that these drones are only appearing in NATO aligned countries makes it seem pretty obvious to me that it's one of two possibilities.
1) Russian sabre-rattling
2) NATO countries running "secret" drills in public in anticipation of 1)
The UFO community is of course running with a third option that doesn't warrant any seriousness.
jiehong 2 minutes ago [-]
One thing that is particularly annoying: the lack of communication from the governments/police about the status of the investigation, or lack thereof.
Side question: How likely are autonomous reconnaissance drones today?
I'd expect them to be impervious to traditional jamming.
I could imagine a pair of drones, a few km apart, communicating by laser line-of-sight, where the reconnaissance one acquires data, send it to the nearby drone, that one would use it to confirm data and do something else with it (aka, spotter and actor).
Cthulhu_ 20 minutes ago [-]
I dunno if calling them "mysterious" is really helpful in this case. Just shoot them down if they get close, that should be the response in a wartime scenario too. Plus, given it's in civilian areas, they can use the expensive laser defense systems to do that.
an0malous 1 minutes ago [-]
The mysteriousness is the main point of the article. These drones aren’t identifiable, across dozens of incursions this year alone, no one has taken any drone down or identified where they’re launching from or returning to in spite of all the advanced NATO satellite imagery and aerial surveillance that can identify individual people on the ground.
boriskourt 55 minutes ago [-]
Not a bad overview of the situation! Worth it for some of the questions about what is actually efficient and not just technically effective. Especially at this scale.
> "The aggressor", he concludes, "will observe, adjust, repeat – until they get through".
Reminds me a lot of digital sec.
baq 41 minutes ago [-]
it's just security, digital or not. sun tzu's art of war is timeless and widely applicable (including outside of the military or even security domains) for a reason.
randomNumber7 29 minutes ago [-]
The way the german government reacts to this makes it pretty easy for any lone actor to do state level damage.
Cthulhu_ 17 minutes ago [-]
That's why I don't understand why there isn't a more aggressive response to flying drones illegally near airports. IMO they should just be shot down.
Actually some years they were very proudly showing birds of prey that they had trained to do just that. Whatever happened to that?
After 9/11 there was a huge worldwide shift in e.g. airplane security due to the threat of terrorism, but now there's drones out there they can fly into planes or that can drop bombs they're doing... what? Mentioning it in the news?
FinnKuhn 12 minutes ago [-]
How do you expect to shoot them down? They are small and very quick and disappear shortly after appearing.
tokai 7 seconds ago [-]
And in may cases its simply not legal to start shooting at unidentified drones in an urban environment.
Toutouxc 46 minutes ago [-]
I still haven’t seen any specifics on the type of drones spotted at those airports. Is the other side just sending random people with cheap FPV drones? Or are they flying Shaheds around airports? I could take my 6” FPV drone and go buzz the tower at a nearby international airport, if I wanted. It costs less than 500€ for the entire kit and with ELRS and high power analog VTx you can do it from kilometers away and run before they catch you. Obviously it’s illegal as fuck.
ACCount37 15 minutes ago [-]
Civilian drones most of the time.
It's thought that it's Russian illegal agents doing this. A lot of them locals recruited online. Really cheap ops done by really cheap people, using cheap and deniable gear.
sigwinch 16 minutes ago [-]
I heard it’s a mix. Suggestible local people on Telegram are coaxed to launch civilian stuff at a time and place. This clouds the sensor data of the true launches.
I don’t know if we’ve seen Shahads since 10 September, but note that Shahads can be ship-launched as well.
__alexs 37 minutes ago [-]
Is this like that time we closed Gatwick for 3 days because of a collective delusion?
Every news report I read about this stuff has at best /r/ufos level of uselessly vague photography.
zipy124 46 seconds ago [-]
I was there for that, ended up getting the eurostart instead, still can't believe that it was basically all for nothing and we still have no information about it really.
26 minutes ago [-]
modzu 54 minutes ago [-]
before ukraine it was aliens
mikkupikku 26 minutes ago [-]
(It was drones then too.)
Yokolos 2 hours ago [-]
If we see a war between Russia and the EU, we're going to have to deal with them learning from Israel and using the same idea of decentralised drone hubs attacking military and civilian targets across the entire continent. We're woefully underprepared to deal with something like this. Western Europe still thinks that if a war breaks out, it'll be tanks and soldiers going into the Baltic states, and we'll crush them with our advanced arsenal. It'll be more like when Russia took eastern Ukraine. A hard push, then months of digging in as they proceed to genocide the Baltics, gaslight the West into thinking it'd be easier and safer to just hand over the Baltics without a big fight and wage asymmetric warfare across Europe and severely hamper any military response by hitting the logistic chains at every point.
bluGill 29 minutes ago [-]
The EU military leaders are watching Ukraine closely (as is any other competent military leader anywhere in the world) and trying to figure out how they will handle this problems. The EU is also talking to Ukraine military leaders and brainstorming solutions that Ukraine is trying in real time (not all military leaders are, but a lot of countries outside of the EU are). The EU is also designing new weapons/systems with the current situation in mind, it is likely that these (whatever they are - this is classified but I can say it with confidence anyway because it is so obvious there is no way they are not doing something) will be ready before Russia attacks.
slightwinder 24 minutes ago [-]
> Western Europe still thinks that if a war breaks out, it'll be tanks and soldiers going into the Baltic states, and we'll crush them with our advanced arsenal.
Drones are not for conquering, but destruction. We see this in Ukraine now, where Drones are not making the whole war, but are just one gear of the machinery. And Western leaders know this, they are preparing Drones, but refitting the western machinery takes time. Probably one reason why they seem busy to bind Russia in Ukraine.
Yokolos 18 minutes ago [-]
> Drones are not for conquering, but destruction.
Yes, and we have plenty of infrastructure to destroy. It's a target rich environment.
> And Western leaders know this, they are preparing Drones
I've seen zero indication that this is true. Do you have sources that we're in any way preparing for a large-scale drone war?
slightwinder 4 minutes ago [-]
> Yes, and we have plenty of infrastructure to destroy. It's a target rich environment.
Yes, but how is that relevant? Everything is always open for terror. Russia itself is not safe either. Or are you assuming Russia is out for pure blind destruction? Degrading themselves to become lousy terrorists? Just spreading destruction for no reason?
I would assume they at least will have some aim and reasoning behind their targets, which would mean they will come with soldiers and tanks, and conquer land, or destroy the highest profile-targets. In the first case, they will have very limited resources to spare for attacks on middle European targets. For the second case, you only need to focus your defence on those targets.
> I've seen zero indication that this is true.
May you are following the wrong sources? Building up drones-defence is in progress for a while now. Whether it's going well is a different story, but I would assume that they will not talk very openly about those things for obvious reasons.
billy99k 54 minutes ago [-]
Do you really think after years of crushing defeats in battle and sanctions, that they have the money or soldiers to fight the EU? If they did, they would have taken over Ukraine by now.
Now if China gets involved? It's a different story.
DocTomoe 13 minutes ago [-]
It's Schroedinger's Red Army: Too incompetent and weak to conquer a third-rate power, but prepared and willing o attack NATO-coordinated Western Europe any day now.
Such is propaganda: You need to keep the population in fear so they will follow your policies.
immibis 47 minutes ago [-]
They don't need money or soldiers, but drones.
victorbjorklund 39 minutes ago [-]
How would they get drones without money or soldiers?
If you read what top generals in various countries in the EU are saying(especially on the East side), their main concern is that Russia is making thousands of brand new tanks, cannons, support vehicles......and they are all going into storage. Very few are actually getting sent to Ukraine. If these guys are saying that large scale conflict with Russia seems almost inevitable within few years.....what qualifications do I have to disagree with them? Obviously I don't want this to be true - far from it.
pdabbadabba 22 minutes ago [-]
I’ve never heard anyone say this. Source?
kakacik 33 minutes ago [-]
Don't underestimate lack if willingness of EU folks to see their dead, or have hospitals or kindergardens bombed by russians on purpose, just like they routinely do in Ukraine. Maybe it can bring on more resistance but I wouldn't hold my breath, european population right now is weak.
Also russia has firm footing in EU politics already - for example every single far right group is parroting russian propaganda even when directly aimed against given country. It took decades to build to sow division in whole EU and they are using it now to their fullest.
[EDIT] Gotta love the downvotes, I am just describing what I see across whole EU including my own country. Would love some constructive feedback but this is clearly a touchy topic for many folks
littlestymaar 53 minutes ago [-]
I'm not convinced by your conclusion.
I mean of course drones would be a massive problem for western forces as they have never faced that kind of threat at scale.
But at the same time the Russian army has suffered dramatic attrition in Ukraine, especially in anti-air capabilities which used to be USSR's specialty and which western analyst feared it would allow the Russians to perform wide anti access on the Baltic's while they would quickly take over the Suvalki corridor and the whole Baltic states soon after.
With limited maneuvering capability left to quickly overwhelm local land armies and a significantly diminished air defense asset, I think the Russians would just lose the sky very quickly and then be unable to supply their ground forces.
And I really don't think Putin wants to lose a quick conventional war and end up with just the nuclear deterrence as his only card so I'm not too worried about him attacking EU directly. (But then again it made little sense to attack Ukraine in the first place yet he did it no matter what, so who knows…)
(Had the Ukrainian army collapsed and the 2022 campaign gone as planned by the Russian command, then the prospects would have been extremely grim for the Baltic states and the European Union as a whole. We Europeans collectively owe a lot to the Ukrainians).
mavhc 59 minutes ago [-]
[flagged]
billy99k 53 minutes ago [-]
Just what we need. They stopped Nuclear energy from taking over in the 70s and 80s, why not destroy Air travel too?
rdtsc 46 minutes ago [-]
Further realization — Russians don’t have to fly drones or sabotage things, they could just “encourage” eco warriors.
I mean they would still be using drones but the drones are just human.
Suddenly wondering if there is any history of Russians/Soviets “sponsoring” the groups who were after Germany shutting down its nuclear reactors…
anonym29 46 minutes ago [-]
Right, because nothing screams "I love the environment" like replacing one five hour flight with 200 48 hour internal combustion car road trips.
zimpenfish 34 minutes ago [-]
Only if every car has only one person - once you start getting 2 or more people in a car, driving starts to win[0] (and that's discounting the heavy multiplier you get from things like coaches and buses.)
Right, but you're missing the part where in the real world, nobody on the plane is going to carpool with other passengers they've never met, they're going to drive themselves in their own car, because people are not automatons that instinctively select the most climate-friendly option.
We shouldn't be comparing the most optimistic outcome in the world as you'd prefer it to be that could happen as a result of the flight being cancelled, we should be comparing the most probable outcome in the world as it actually exists.
bluGill 26 minutes ago [-]
Those problems have never stopped the environmental movement before, so why would they now. (they could have supported nuclear a couple decades ago and we would be in much better shape environmentally)
klez 17 minutes ago [-]
What about trains, though?
37 minutes ago [-]
thatgerhard 35 minutes ago [-]
The BBC is pretty much the onion now imo.. They lie which makes them the opposite of the news.
monooso 27 minutes ago [-]
Oh hai Donald.
Rendered at 14:59:20 GMT+0000 (Coordinated Universal Time) with Vercel.
1) Russian sabre-rattling
2) NATO countries running "secret" drills in public in anticipation of 1)
The UFO community is of course running with a third option that doesn't warrant any seriousness.
Side question: How likely are autonomous reconnaissance drones today?
I'd expect them to be impervious to traditional jamming.
I could imagine a pair of drones, a few km apart, communicating by laser line-of-sight, where the reconnaissance one acquires data, send it to the nearby drone, that one would use it to confirm data and do something else with it (aka, spotter and actor).
> "The aggressor", he concludes, "will observe, adjust, repeat – until they get through".
Reminds me a lot of digital sec.
Actually some years they were very proudly showing birds of prey that they had trained to do just that. Whatever happened to that?
After 9/11 there was a huge worldwide shift in e.g. airplane security due to the threat of terrorism, but now there's drones out there they can fly into planes or that can drop bombs they're doing... what? Mentioning it in the news?
It's thought that it's Russian illegal agents doing this. A lot of them locals recruited online. Really cheap ops done by really cheap people, using cheap and deniable gear.
I don’t know if we’ve seen Shahads since 10 September, but note that Shahads can be ship-launched as well.
Every news report I read about this stuff has at best /r/ufos level of uselessly vague photography.
Drones are not for conquering, but destruction. We see this in Ukraine now, where Drones are not making the whole war, but are just one gear of the machinery. And Western leaders know this, they are preparing Drones, but refitting the western machinery takes time. Probably one reason why they seem busy to bind Russia in Ukraine.
Yes, and we have plenty of infrastructure to destroy. It's a target rich environment.
> And Western leaders know this, they are preparing Drones
I've seen zero indication that this is true. Do you have sources that we're in any way preparing for a large-scale drone war?
Yes, but how is that relevant? Everything is always open for terror. Russia itself is not safe either. Or are you assuming Russia is out for pure blind destruction? Degrading themselves to become lousy terrorists? Just spreading destruction for no reason?
I would assume they at least will have some aim and reasoning behind their targets, which would mean they will come with soldiers and tanks, and conquer land, or destroy the highest profile-targets. In the first case, they will have very limited resources to spare for attacks on middle European targets. For the second case, you only need to focus your defence on those targets.
> I've seen zero indication that this is true.
May you are following the wrong sources? Building up drones-defence is in progress for a while now. Whether it's going well is a different story, but I would assume that they will not talk very openly about those things for obvious reasons.
Now if China gets involved? It's a different story.
Such is propaganda: You need to keep the population in fear so they will follow your policies.
China, Turkey, and India are main buyers of Russian oil at the moment: https://energyandcleanair.org/october-2025-monthly-analysis-...
Also russia has firm footing in EU politics already - for example every single far right group is parroting russian propaganda even when directly aimed against given country. It took decades to build to sow division in whole EU and they are using it now to their fullest.
[EDIT] Gotta love the downvotes, I am just describing what I see across whole EU including my own country. Would love some constructive feedback but this is clearly a touchy topic for many folks
I mean of course drones would be a massive problem for western forces as they have never faced that kind of threat at scale.
But at the same time the Russian army has suffered dramatic attrition in Ukraine, especially in anti-air capabilities which used to be USSR's specialty and which western analyst feared it would allow the Russians to perform wide anti access on the Baltic's while they would quickly take over the Suvalki corridor and the whole Baltic states soon after.
With limited maneuvering capability left to quickly overwhelm local land armies and a significantly diminished air defense asset, I think the Russians would just lose the sky very quickly and then be unable to supply their ground forces.
And I really don't think Putin wants to lose a quick conventional war and end up with just the nuclear deterrence as his only card so I'm not too worried about him attacking EU directly. (But then again it made little sense to attack Ukraine in the first place yet he did it no matter what, so who knows…)
(Had the Ukrainian army collapsed and the 2022 campaign gone as planned by the Russian command, then the prospects would have been extremely grim for the Baltic states and the European Union as a whole. We Europeans collectively owe a lot to the Ukrainians).
I mean they would still be using drones but the drones are just human.
Suddenly wondering if there is any history of Russians/Soviets “sponsoring” the groups who were after Germany shutting down its nuclear reactors…
[0] https://terrapass.com/blog/carbon-footprint-of-driving-vs-fl...
We shouldn't be comparing the most optimistic outcome in the world as you'd prefer it to be that could happen as a result of the flight being cancelled, we should be comparing the most probable outcome in the world as it actually exists.