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The Prime Reasons to Avoid Amazon (blog.thenewoil.org)
Animats 2 hours ago [-]
A real reason to avoid Amazon is fake merchandise. I'd been buying a vitamin supplement from them for years. Then they sent me a notice that it was being recalled as a fake.[1] (Archive [2]) They paid a refund for the last purchase. But that's all. Amazon won't respond to questions about what was in it or who the real seller is.

I no longer buy anything from Amazon that could be faked.

[1] https://www.amazon.com/ask/questions/Tx2Q5O0C84HF1GU/

[2] https://archive.is/rN8B9

SoftTalker 2 hours ago [-]
Good rule of thumb is that if it goes on or in your body do not buy it from Amazon.
sharkweek 2 minutes ago [-]
I’m about to start grad school to get my clinical mental health counseling licensure, and Amazon has ton of fake DSM-5s (basically the holy grail of recognized mental disorders and their insurance billing codes) on it, so much in fact that my program director mentioned the Amazon problem in the orientation.

So I’ll add “if you need to guarantee the accuracy of the information in whatever you’re buying… avoid Amazon as well”

parhamn 36 minutes ago [-]
Where's the best value & quality for that sort of stuff? It's insane what some sites charge for seemingly simple supplements.
7speter 2 minutes ago [-]
Vitacost.com has worked well for me.
toomuchtodo 11 minutes ago [-]
encomiast 1 hours ago [-]
I wonder if this applies to Amazon Pharmacy — seems like maybe this might have a bit more governance.
throwup238 21 minutes ago [-]
Amazon Pharmacy is its own regulated pharmacy with licenses in all of the states, not a marketplace/platform like Amazon.com.

It’s really a renamed PillPack [1] which they acquired in 2018 with (I assume) Amazon Pharmacy launching on top of their licenses in 2020

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PillPack

speed_spread 33 minutes ago [-]
I buy my pills on AliExpress, it's much safer.
recursive 1 hours ago [-]
Or if it's electronic. Fire risk.
blibble 43 minutes ago [-]
the fact legitimate electricians buy fuses/wiring/circuit breakers/crimps off amazon thinking they're as advertised is actually terrifying

all the buildings you enter: houses of friends/family, supermarkets, hospitals, transport, restaurants, offices, all with potentially fatal fake electrics

hopefully the fire door and extinguishers weren't bought from amazon

SoftTalker 38 minutes ago [-]
I recall reading about some counterfeit circuit breakers that were basically just toggle switches. They had no "trip" mechanism at all.

The few tradespeople I know don't even shop at Lowes. They have accounts at supply houses that don't even offer public retail sales.

davidw 1 hours ago [-]
I know it's not a very popular cause these days, but "Democracy" seems like a real reason too.
PenguinCoder 1 hours ago [-]
My rule is anything that goes on or in my body, I don't buy form Amazon for that reason.
bilsbie 2 hours ago [-]
I’m having trouble finding alternatives. Do I really have to go to four or five different websites to buy my supplements.
1 hours ago [-]
immibis 1 hours ago [-]
have you tried a physical pharmacy
wredcoll 1 hours ago [-]
Um. Exactly how many supplements do you need?
junon 10 minutes ago [-]
Why is that any of your business?
apt-apt-apt-apt 2 hours ago [-]
How do you know what cannot be faked? Is shipped and sold by Amazon enough?
nurettin 2 hours ago [-]
I understood fake as physically harmful.
qgin 1 hours ago [-]
It is, people are being ridiculous. The third party stuff is where the fraud is.
onli 1 hours ago [-]
No, that is not correct or at least it has not been. Amazon was said to intermingle the inventory in the warehouses, mixing third party products with those shipped and sold by Amazon. So that gave you zero protection.

I read that they made internal changes to tag shippings properly to reduce the risk of that behaviour, but am not sure it is true or has been effective.

ranger_danger 4 minutes ago [-]
I have absolutely bought multiple hard drives that were "shipped & sold by amazon" which turned out to be fake/counterfeit in some way. The serial numbers did not verify on the manufacturer's website either and they were completely DOA.
PaulDavisThe1st 38 minutes ago [-]
> Amazon needs to be stopped, and legislation will not do so. Only its loyal consumers – who keep the beast alive – can do that by taking their money elsewhere.

We've (my wife and I) tried to stop using Amazon. But recently, I've run into issues where I need particular specialized bits and pieces (e.g. just today, a low profile 4" HVAC 90 degree elbow) that are only available via Amazon. A variation is where the item is available from one or two other places, but at a 10x markup.

We need to convince vendors to also avoid Amazon, and that may be even more of a difficult sell (no pun intended).

ps. Amazon employee #2, and I approve this message.

hinterlands 33 minutes ago [-]
The other problem are people doing price arbitrage. You find the item on eBay and think to yourself, "cool, I'd rather patronize a small business" - but as it turns out, the item is drop-shipped from Amazon, Walmart, or the like.
w-ll 31 minutes ago [-]
This got me the other day, and it had me cracking up, they just put my shipping address and and checked out from Walmart. $5 lesson that Walmart actually sold what i wanted and i should have checked there first.
lisper 33 minutes ago [-]
I would love to avoid Amazon, and indeed I would love to support local retailers, but more often than not it is simply impossible. The only way I can find out if a local vendor carries an item I'm interested in, and if they have it in stock, is to physically go there. The amount of time that requires is orders of magnitude more than what it takes to order the item on Amazon, where I am all but guaranteed that it will be available.

It is astonishing to me that brick-and-mortar retailers have not banded together to put an on-line front-end onto their stock. It would technically straightforward (albeit not trivial) to build a web site as easy to use as Amazon, but with guaranteed same-day or next-day delivery via a partner like doordash, and with more reliable quality because local vendors have more of an incentive to vet their suppliers. I would love to use a service like that, but AFAICT it doesn't exist.

Someone here, please build this. I will be your first customer.

mitthrowaway2 29 minutes ago [-]
I've been hoping someone would build the same thing. Even without delivery, I'd love to be able to search for products across multiple stores through a web interface and see their availability in a map view, with price and in-stock status. I would be happy to go to the store and buy it, as long as I only need to make one trip and I know it will be in stock and at a certain price.
PhoneTag 28 minutes ago [-]
You seem to forget that you can call nearly any local retailer and they will check their inventory for you and often even set it aside for you. A phone call does not require orders of magnitude more time than an online order and you can build a friendly connection in your community that way, too.
______ 38 minutes ago [-]
A good first step is not paying for Prime.

It's like $140 annually now... and if you're mostly just buying things and not watching their content, it's a nice speed bump to just accumulate items in the cart until you hit the minimum free shipping and only order then.

When you occasionally do for some reason need an instant item, you can pay the shipping then. It's kinda like for most people, having a second or third car is much more expensive than just renting one when you actually need it.

That said, I am close to a Costco so that's where I get most of my bulk items - the Amazon stuff tends to be more discretionary.

fvgvkujdfbllo 18 minutes ago [-]
That’s the key.

Amazon is very convenient when needing something one off. But we are not going to renew Prime and slowly ween off it.

Still looking for alternatives though, Costco is okay, but when you want something asap, you need either to drive to stores or pay for same day delivery and tips.

kristianp 1 hours ago [-]
I wish our local postage carrier was more efficient. Amazon provides next day delivery, whilst other online stores dispatch your purchase within 2-3 days and the package arrives is a further 2-5 days.
add-sub-mul-div 47 minutes ago [-]
I noped out of Prime a long time ago when it became clear they were training the population to treat all their purchases as instant gratification impulse buys.
Den_VR 29 minutes ago [-]
That’s a bit interesting. Do you have similar ideas about commercial air travel?
add-sub-mul-div 14 minutes ago [-]
No, because taking a week out of my life to go by train instead of plane is impractical. Making myself wait a few extra business days for my books to arrive is not. I apologize if you had a better point you were trying to make and I missed it.
kevin_thibedeau 40 minutes ago [-]
How much of your spending requires instant gratification?
Aloisius 20 minutes ago [-]
Presumably nothing they buy from Amazon.

If they wanted instant gratification, they'd buy it from a local store and get it immediately rather than having to wait a couple days.

29 minutes ago [-]
II2II 12 minutes ago [-]
It can be about predictability as well. If Amazon says two days, it is usually two days. I arrange the purchase for a day when I don't work or work a short shift. If it is a valuable product that requires someone to receive the parcel, I don't have to deal with shippers who force people to use a pickup point that is a 15 minute drive away. (I don't drive, so that is usually problematic.) At the end of the day, in my case, it is more about receiving the product than getting it right away.
gibbitz 15 minutes ago [-]
All of my restaurant purchases for sure.
dosinga 56 minutes ago [-]
Am I missing something, the article randomly says: "For context, the US federal government spent $53 million on public education in 2022." and links to: https://educationdata.org/public-education-spending-statisti... which says K-12 schools spend $857.2 billion.
bentt 2 minutes ago [-]
Yeah that bit seems wrong. I agree with the overall sentiment of the article, but that is off.
wging 50 minutes ago [-]
The federal government is distinct from state or local governments. The numbers still might not be consistent (it says “[t]he federal government provides 13.6% of funding for public K-12 education”, which would be more than $53MM) but the page you linked draws that distinction too. State and local funds make up the difference.
bluGill 30 minutes ago [-]
I can almost always find a small company - often thing-i-want.com that has just as good deals and they provide useful advice about which version is best - often I have bought the more expensive version for those reasons. (I think for the better though I rarely buy enough of anything to have an informed opinion on relative merit)
PaulHoule 1 hours ago [-]
Myself I can't stand the media blitz that tries to talk up Prime Day every year.

I like hunting for bargains as much as anybody, I love checking out the used games at Gamestop or items on clearance at Best Buy, not least the reuse center at Ithaca where I might find a cassette or Video CD deck with karaoke features or a minidisc player.

Prime Day seems to be just a waste of time. I don't see any attractive prices on anything I want to buy. So many web sites scour Amazon for good deals and can't find any. It's a snoozer.

heavyset_go 18 minutes ago [-]
It's because Amazon buyers are used to Amazon prices.

It's literally been a decade or more since Prime Day, or Amazon in general, had the best prices online.

PaulHoule 15 minutes ago [-]
I’ve often seen items selling in physical stores (like a UV tooth whitening kit) for $40 and at Amazon for $65.
jkuli 3 minutes ago [-]
It's not enough to be against Amazon. You need to be against everyone who - sells tech to the gov, - undercuts prices, - exploits employees, - lobbies for regulation.

Not to mention the real reason we hate Jeff Bezos. Because you wouldn't like it if I mentioned it.

submeta 44 minutes ago [-]
Amazon manipulates your product searches. When you search for a product, it will push a few select brands and you won’t get past that, except you deliberately search for a specific brand. So it will limit your options. But it will give you the illusion to show you a large amount of various brands.

Searching for a product category on Google won‘t allow you to find a big number of brands either. Because they will push certain products as well.

So be aware that these platforms will limit your options.

But I admit that Amazon has a very polished UX. It‘s a one-stop shop, returns are handled very generously, and you don’t need to visit a dozen sites to get various products.

Aloisius 2 hours ago [-]
I understand hyperbole is a useful rhetorical device, but it's very hard for me to take anyone who uses it seriously or trust anything they say at all.

And it really doesn't help develop trust when the citations used to support one's points directly contradicts them (like that bit about Amazon providing real-time surveillance from Ring doorbells to police without owners' knowledge - the one and only thing I decided to read the source for which said quite the opposite).

It's a shame too since I'm sure the author had some good points, but I have neither the time nor energy to research every single claim made to see which ones aren't bullshit.

coredog64 1 hours ago [-]
It’s right there in the second paragraph of the WaPo(!) story that Ring owners opt in and can decline to share data.

Does Rekognition perform poorly? Maybe it does, but it’s a best effort service, not a police officer in a box. That AWS was shamed into not selling it to law enforcement doesn’t mean law enforcement won’t have access to facial recognition, only that the vendor they choose isn’t capable of being embarrassed by bad PR.

Aloisius 1 hours ago [-]
Yes. That made me scratch my head. It also says explicitly that no real-time feeds were available. It appears the program just let police contact owners to request video. Never mind that program was discontinued last year.

I can only assume the author didn't think anyone would read the links they provided.

Phelinofist 53 minutes ago [-]
Honestly I hate Amazon because they are a mega corp that just gets bigger and bigger. But on the other hand they are just the best online store hands down. I ordered an electric toothbrush yesterday at 23:30 and it arrived today at 15:30 - that's just amazing. Also returning stuff is hassle-free and they often are the cheapest.

I tried using Otto for some time but it just cannot compare. Sure. I could also shop from multiple shops but that is kinda waste of time. Amazon is a real one-stop shop.

witty_username 51 minutes ago [-]
Why do you hate mega corps getting bigger and bigger if they provide good service?
gibbitz 12 minutes ago [-]
As they get bigger competing with them becomes harder and harder as their overhead per transaction reduces due to volume. Eventually they become the only choice. I feel like with Amazon this is nearly the case. Many local brick-and-mortar stores that would have existed in the early 200's are non-existent today. Even chains like RadioShack and Circuit City are gone. This leaves the next alternative to be slower and more expensive online stores that struggle to compete.
jbermudes 1 hours ago [-]
Many of the things the author accuses Amazon of doing are troubling, but the logic the author used in the Chris Brown music buying example to tie it all together shows of a lack of distinction between types of cooperation with evil.

When an act has both a potentially good and bad effect Philosophers like to distinguish the morality of this act of "cooperating with evil" by analyzing the degrees to which your cooperation is:

  - formal or material (do you want the bad thing to happen and that's why you're buying from Amazon?)
  - immediate or mediate (are you supplying a critical component such that without your specific instance of cooperation the evil could not occur?)
  - proximate or remote (Do you work for Amazon?)
Each of these dimensions should be taken into consideration because without such analysis one can easily become scrupulous about every act that one does that may have unintended side effects. This is how you get people who say things like "there is no such thing as ethical consumption in capitalism" and other extreme statements that would otherwise force you to be a monk in a desert lest your acts accidentally create harm.

To learn more about this principle of double effect:

https://thinkingthoughtout.com/2021/01/24/cooperation-with-e...

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/double-effect/

Spivak 2 hours ago [-]
I feel like the author is undermining their own complaint in regards to Rekognition. Anyone can just sign up for an AWS account and start using the service, pretty much the same as anything else AWS sells. Then in response to specific bad behavior by US police departments Amazon cut off their access, a practice they've kept up to this day.

Amazon could have quietly (or loudly in 2025) lifted the ban at any point in the last five years to much nothing in the terms of pushback.

johncole 1 hours ago [-]
Would you consider Target or Walmart more ethical? Or better at policing counterfeits?
cogman10 1 hours ago [-]
Strangely enough, yes to both (at least for in store purchases). And I find neither company particularly ethical.

They have a tighter control on their supply chain and don't have a truly open "market" where anyone can sell crap (or stolen crap).

A lot of this comes down to limited stocking and shelf space. Amazon effectively has unlimited storage space. Hence their ability to show off 6000 drop shipping products which are actually the same product.

Walmart and Target, on the other hand, have to be somewhat judicious because shelf space is limited. They can't have a row of the same products under different labels. And if what they choose to sell has quality problems they get hit harder for it. They take the loss for the unsold counterfeit goods. Amazon, by their nature, sees minimal hits when products are determined to be counterfeit. That usually just means they blacklist a seller. They are hardly impacted.

Also, funnily enough, it's why I don't worry about counterfeits at Wholefoods even though it's parent company is Amazon.

yupitsme123 52 minutes ago [-]
What you said is true for their physical locations, but both Target and Walmart implemented Amazon-style marketplaces a while back, and my impression is that there's very little oversight or quality control. Even less than on Amazon.
SoftTalker 31 minutes ago [-]
I'm pretty sure they don't co-mingle though. So if you make sure you're buying from Walmart or Target and not some other party you should be getting the same items that are in the stores.
yupitsme123 27 minutes ago [-]
Yes, it's on you to identify if the seller is Target or a third party. It's listed on the product page, but if you didnt know that there were third party items, you would probably just assume you were buying from Target/Walmart.
ajross 2 hours ago [-]
I guess, but Amazon gets me stuff tomorrow or the next day, reliably, week in and week out. Yeah, I could find this stuff elsewhere on the internet. But not for Tuesday delivery. And not without opening another account. Also, right now, often only by paying a tariff-adjacent fee to cover the import costs of the vendors that didn't have the foresight to pre-stock imports like Amazon did.

People who want to write stuff like this really need to reckon with the fact that Amazon is and remains the superior product, and by a very significant degree.

They're not winning because they "hate democracy" or are "full-stop evil" or whatever. They're winning because they're the best.

ezst 1 hours ago [-]
And that's kind of an issue. Amazon effectively has a monopoly in this space, and competing at a similar level just is not possible anymore. And Amazon is so big that, even when you have a better product and service, it can buy you off¹.

¹: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Souq_(company)

no_wizard 2 hours ago [-]
This is the reality.

I have moved anything I don’t need quickly off Amazon as much as reasonably possible, and I do avoid some things from Amazon as well, but for too many things they’re the cheapest and fastest option, or the 2nd cheapest and fastest option.

Also if I think there is a reasonably high chance I’ll return an item, I also go through Amazon, because they haven’t once in 20 years I’ve been using them giving me an issue, charged a restocking fee etc.

Other online shops simply don’t match enough of these Amazon value prop to sway me over

PaulHoule 1 hours ago [-]
My take is that Walmart.com comes pretty close. When I was driving through Pennsylvania two weeks back I saw a huge Walmart.com warehouse right next to an Amazon warehouse. The last mile delivery service of the two seems close to identical (though Walmart+ disingenuously offers "free" delivery from my local store that expect you to tip the driver. [1])

Amazon often costs 5 cents less and you might find that all the issues of Bocci the Rock are at Amazon and one is missing from Walmart, but Walmart is taking the fight to them.

For photography stuff in particular, I buy from B&H, Adorama or direct from vendors such as Red River Paper. Often the prices are better than Amazon and the service is much better (e.g. the owner of the later has schooled me on details of papers and printing that most people couldn't imagine)

[1] Not against giving the tip, just against saying I don't like the comparison against free shipping from other vendors.

no_wizard 11 minutes ago [-]
If the ida is to avoid Amazon on any sort of ethical basis (including monopolistic practices and squeezing suppliers etc) Walmart is no different. You could change any issue you have with Amazon and replace it with Walmart and they all still apply, sans the peeing in bottles of delivery drivers
ajross 1 hours ago [-]
FWIW, my suspicion is that people motivated by "Amazon is full-stop evil and an enemy of Civil Rights, Human Rights, Workers, Small Businesses, and Democracy"[1] would be even less motivated to shop at the temple of Sam Walton.

But even so, I just checked and of the last 12 items in my Amazon purchase history, Walmart.com loses on every one of them before shipping is included. They're not really in the game absent externalities like location or specific product.

[1] Not hyperbole: those are the sections in the linked article!

PaulHoule 39 minutes ago [-]
I have my own grievances with Amazon, not least that 2 day shipping became 5 day shipping without warning during the pandemic although I know they had infrastructure in my area because for years I saw their delivery van going around on Sunday. I felt it was really unfair because if I have to wait 5 days for something to arrive I am inclined to go get it at Target or another store in town if I can.

Since then I’ve taken them up on offers of a free month of Prime or a week for $2 which is attractive if it gets me free shipping on a purchase. Now I get the same service as everyone else but if they wanted to be a loyal customer hey should have treated me as if they wanted to impress me as an earlier.

Notably Walmart has a + service which is a little cheaper than Prime but doesn’t have the video and other benefits that I’m indifferent too. I agree with the direction of that guy’s critiques of Amazon but not the magnitude but I’m a strange case in that I’m an amateur political scientist who works as a software dev with real political scientists that I have to be deferential to.

viraptor 1 hours ago [-]
Amazon enables us to buy lots of things we just wouldn't if there was just a little bit more of friction. I'm not sure it's an overall positive that they have next day delivery. We'd definitely be better overall if Amazon didn't undermine smaller shops using discounts only they can afford long term.
fred_is_fred 2 hours ago [-]
Canceling my Prime account mainly meant I bought less stuff overall. A win for my wallet and the planet in the end. I need zero friction in my life for healthy eating and exercise, not for buying crap from a Chinese brand of the week (Glorf, Qerdu, Plund or whatever).
ajross 2 hours ago [-]
> Canceling my Prime account mainly meant I bought less stuff overall.

Which sounds like an agreement with my point, no? Buying stuff without Amazon was in aggregate "more expensive" for you in the broader sense of value that includes effort/experience/whatever. So you didn't.

And, bravo? I'm all for efficiency and reasonable asceticism, and likely agree with you about the general consumerist bent of our society.

All I'm saying is that constitutes an argument in FAVOR of Amazon as a retailer product, and not an indictment.

SlowTao 1 hours ago [-]
This statement is not an attack on your character or being just a broad generalization.

The biggest addiction of the modern era is convenience. Once people have it, it is very difficult to give up. We are all addicted to this, we aren't running this site via the letters column in a newspaper, because of convenience. But it also means we tend to ignore the negatives of said services.

Your point of them winning because they're the best, that can also be true. But because of that and the convenience addiction they provide, we let them get away with all the other stuff.

I'm not saying this is an excuse to use Amazon, I have never used it. I am just saying it is a hard hurdle for some to overcome.

tenuousemphasis 1 hours ago [-]
Humans survived up until about 20 years ago without free 2-day shipping. You'll be fine.

Or you could compromise your morals for convenience, I guess.

kevin_thibedeau 37 minutes ago [-]
It's not free. It's baked into the price.
AvAn12 43 minutes ago [-]
It’s like some Soviet-style retailer where everyone is supposed to shop for everything. It’s about as contrary to competitive capitalism as a company can be. I signed off two years ago and haven’t missed it for a minute - though you should make your own decisions, as with everything.
starik36 30 minutes ago [-]
I don't think you have the slightest idea of what a Soviet style retailer is.

Standing in line for 2 hours to buy milk with my grandma is a childhood memory that's burned into my brain.

whall6 1 hours ago [-]
This honestly may as well have been a paid ad by Amazon. It served as a reminder for me that Prime Day is coming up. That reminder was followed up with several extremely weak arguments that Amazon is the pinnacle of evil. Also felt like it was written largely by AI
deadbabe 40 minutes ago [-]
The only standard I hold Amazon to is if they can get me the things I want in the fastest time. Until someone does that better, I have no reasons not to use Amazon.
gibbitz 4 minutes ago [-]
This behavior works in a competitive, monopoly averse economy. In the US, this means you will eventuy have no alternative to Amazon.

I've been thinking about the poor quality and availability of Communist goods in the 1980s. I think about the bread lines every time I shop at Costco. What happened to make us so complacent?

unit149 29 minutes ago [-]
[dead]
bawana 2 hours ago [-]
[flagged]
SoftTalker 30 minutes ago [-]
Yeah and once you notice that you can't unsee it.
renewiltord 2 hours ago [-]
Trains are shaped like penis, bus is shape like penis, skyscraper is shape like penis, rocket is shape like penis, now Amazon logo is shape like penis? Why are all Americans always looking everywhere for shape like penis. Every time.

"Hello, American, look at this pencil"

"Pencil?! Shaped like penis!"

"Hello, American, look at your hands"

"Oh my god! That is five penises a hand!"

Constantly searching for penis everywhere. Is there reason for this? It is not as common elsewhere, but American is always constantly searching for penis. If not provided, American will construct it out of household objects. Desperate for penis, American will find it even in intangible objects like logo.

DanAtC 1 hours ago [-]
renewiltord 52 minutes ago [-]
Ha! Good reference. Look at perplexity logo. It is fan of rectangular slats with line in middle. To American this is "butthole". Can only imagine that in USA, people are like duck with strangely corkscrewing genitals. Fan shaped butthole is for insertion of Torx T6 bit perhaps, to fulfill local slang of "screwing".
immibis 1 hours ago [-]
I guess people want what they can't have, and Americans are shielded from body parts since birth.
djoldman 1 hours ago [-]
Regardless of what one thinks about Amazon, one's actions have approximately zero effect on it.

Even if one controlled, 10, 100, 1,000, 10,000, or 100,000 people and commanded them to not use Amazon, it would have little effect.

If someone opts to stay away from Amazon, they should at least do it with clear eyes: they are doing it to feel something and will not actually affect the company.

bluGill 33 minutes ago [-]
It would have a big effect on the alternatives though.
recursive 1 hours ago [-]
I do it not for the feelings but just to avoid hypocrisy.
jvanderbot 1 hours ago [-]
I hate to be this guy, really, but did you consider that hypocrisy and anti-hypocrisy is basically what OP meant by "feelings" since they are based on (mostly self) perceptions? (Have you ever pointed out hypocrisy to someone? They are quick to tell you why you're wrong - it's absolutely about self justification not external judgement)
add-sub-mul-div 51 minutes ago [-]
I don't understand the point you're making. Someone is living according to their principles and we're playing games with semantics as if "feelings" is a bad word? Okay, you win, it "feels" better to satisfy one's values.
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